Hello, all!

Hope you're doing well. Okay, here's the inaugeral reading room submission: Leadership and Macbeth. This is similar to the other article I wrote on Hamlet and leadership. In writing the Macbeth piece, I began to realize that Lady Macbeth is probably the more compelling leadership character. At any rate, I would enjoy hearing your thoughts and feedback on this.

I'm trying to write a fictionalized account of Lady Macbeth right now. It has nothing whatsoever to do with quality, management, ISO 9001, or anything else, but it might be entertaining. I'm hoping to recruit Roxane to do the audio version.

Craig

I liked this piece, :applause: just as I liked the book Elizabeth I, CEO by Alan Axelrod.

I sometimes read in BusinessWeek about leadership, and more recently the magazine featured articles regarding the lack of good leadership training in many MBA programs.

It occured to me that, of all places, wouldn't business school want to train in leadership--does not doing so mean they are more or less turning out technicians?

Yes, it is a good time for this kind of article. Now how can we get you out on the major talk circuit, hmmm? :tg:

Jennifer

It occured to me that, of all places, wouldn't business school want to train in leadership--does not doing so mean they are more or less turning out technicians?
Jennifer

Blaming business schools for managers who evince no leadership is like blaming my high school music teacher for the fact that I can't sing.

Jennifer,

Thanks for taking a look at the article. I appreciate your kind comments. I agree that leadership and ethics don't really get addressed much in business schools. Back when I was working on my MBA, there was one elective course on leadership (a very good one, in fact) and no courses on ethics.

JSW05,

Of course schools can't be blamed for the behavior of individuals. You're exactly right about that. Graduate business schools can and should shape their students, though. Most business schools have only recently started down that path of leadership development and ethics. The curriculum has always revolved around short term accounting numbers and how managers can influence them. With that kind of education, it's no wonder that people like Bernard Ebbers are going to jail. (I hope it's a long jail term, too.) Ironically, I don't think Bernard Ebbers ever went to business school.

Craig

Nice article, by the way:agree1:

Of course schools can't be blamed for the behavior of individuals

My suggestion was that business schools can't be blamed for the talents (or lack thereof) of their students.

[QUOTE=ccochran]Graduate business schools can and should shape their students, though.

I don't think I like the sound of this. I don't think schools should be involved in "shaping" anyone, if by shaping you mean indoctrinating into a predetermined mode--I'm sorry, paradigm--of behavior and thought.

Most business schools have only recently started down that path of leadership development and ethics.

I think that teaching about leadership development and ethics are both good things, but both have inherent limitations. I think you might get a different ethics class at a religious university than you would get at a public school, for instance. And I think we need to be careful of the idea that hapless mopes can be turned into leaders by motivational speakers.

The curriculum has always revolved around short term accounting numbers and how managers can influence them..

Becasue that's what executives have always been expected to be concerned with. The job of business schools, imo, is to prepare people for reality, not some pollyanna, pie-in-the-sky vision of what some questionably-credentialled academic (present company excluded, of course) thinks things should be. Business schools will always teach the skills needed in the marketplace (or they should, anyway).

With that kind of education, it's no wonder that people like Bernard Ebbers are going to jail. (I hope it's a long jail term, too.) Ironically, I don't think Bernard Ebbers ever went to business school.

Bernie and his lawyers wanted us to believe that he accumulated $1 billion in net worth but didn't know how to count it. :bonk:

Craig,

I have been to busy to have a look at what you've put together this time, but I hope to get the time for it during the weekend.

/Claes :read:

JSWO5 makes some good, insighful points.

Interestingly, I do quite feel as though our public school system is being charged to do this very thing: shape our children as both thinkers and good citizens. We provide services of a scope unmatched in history. We are now the sum of the missing social services.

We are being blamed if they do not learn to be good workers, as well as able to calculate and write coherently; the recent criticism from businesses and colleges is that the kids can't take criticism, can't deal with "No" or "You have failed in this".

I hasten to add that there is a misunderstanding overall in that education is being viewed as a pay-and-receive service. You pay, we deliver or else.

This is a misunderstanding. Education is probably THE greatest example of a service where the customer has an equal opportunity, and responsibility, for a successful outcome. Critics forget that every day.

I mention leadership in management schools because their graduates very often go on to lead groups, then departments, then companies. It makes sense to teach what that involves. People skills. Business is about far more than numbers, marketing, etc.

And yes, some schools are beginning to offer that now.

Same goes for ethics classes. No, we can't teach people to think morally as in a spiritual sense,(that should have been done in the family--but aren't we doing this when teaching citizenship to kids?) but we can, and should point out the various consequences that good and poor decisions render. The devil-may-care attitude shown by our scandalized business leaders--a minority, to be fair--shows an opportunity to point out to up and comers that all deeds have some consequence. They can do case studies and decide for themselves what kind of people to be. That's all we can do, and I think we should.

Ok, read it. Very interesting piece, Craig.

A leader posesses courage. Yes, a leader does need courage, and leading from the front is considered a virtue, but wait... Did I hear someone say delegate? Sometimes it takes courage to let go, to delegate things to people better suited or with more time for the task at hand. After all, a good leader also knows that he cannot do everything himself.

A leader is never manipulated. Manipulated, no... But a good leader must be prepared to make decisions based on fact. It is therefore sometimes necessary to let yourself be persuaded to change your course of action.

A leader maintains a sense of humility. Yes... Without a sense of humility you will surely fail the two things mentioned above and probably others as well.

Er... "The witches each greet Hamlet in turn" (page 1)?

All in all: Great job, Craig. keep them coming. :agree1:

/Claes

A leader maintains a sense of humility. Yes... Without a sense of humility you will surely fail the two things mentioned above and probably others as well.

"If I only had a sense of humility, I'd be perfect."
Ted Turner

Claes,

Sorry for the slow response. Thanks for the feedback on the Macbeth article. You made some excellent points, as always. And thanks especially for catching the cameo (and unintended) appearance of Hamlet on page 1! These characters have a way of floating around in my head and popping in where they're not supposed to.

JSW05,

Ted Turner is a local Atlantan, so I enjoyed the reference to him. Yes, humility is not exactly his strength.

Hope all is well,
Craig

Sorry for the slow response. No worries. I'm not always Speedy Gonzales myself, and my own posting has been rather limited and sporadic in the last few weeks. I've been a wee bit busy...
These characters have a way of floating around in my head and popping in where they're not supposed to. I know the feeling, as it happens to me as well. It's always nice to know that I'm not alone in being a bit absent minded at times :lol: .

A bonus link for Will's fanclub: The complete works of William Shakespeare. (http://the-tech.mit.edu/Shakespeare/works.html)

/Claes

Claes,

Thanks for posting the link to the complete works of Shakespeare. What a great resource! I've already used it to find a quote that I knew existed, but couldn't locate.

Craig

I've already used it to find a quote that I knew existed, but couldn't locate. Brilliant :agree1: What was it? Can we look forward to yet another Shakespeare lesson now?

/Claes

Ah yes, "Macbeth is a work that all leaders would benefit from studying and remembering, both as a warning and a reminder to create a world worth living in." Craig Cochran

Craig, thanks for sharing! :)

Muleskinner,

Thanks a bunch. I need to get cracking on some more writing. I've been in a funk lately...

Have a good weekend,
Craig

Craig,

Good morning to you! I've been in a funk myself lately, until doing this fresh read on "Shakespeare's Lessons in Leadership: Macbeth". I haven't read Shakespeare in nearly 40 years.

The insight you provide in this article has cleared muddy waters. Having renewed interest in Shakespeare's Macbeth, I plan to study it once again from beginning to end.

As I read your article, the words do in fact leap from the pages, facilitating new levels of understanding.

Again, Thanks!

Just read yur article, doing an analysis on MacBeth as a measure for leaders. MacBeth may not have been a leader. He may have been a caretaker, since some business will place one in place of a leader.
Are there Leaders anymore? I can not think of one person in a power postiion that meets any of the critera you have set up. ( these are at the end of my post). Most business people remind me of Phoarhs or Cesars in their manners and directions they take. When taking over from another CEO, they attempt to eliminate any essence of the formal. I have yet, met a person who would even attempt a "Marc Antony" speech from Shakespeare's Cesar when talking about format CEOs.
Looking at Shakespeare's works on the History of England, Is there any main character or King that exhibits anyone of the elements that you require a leader to have? If they do not have these qualities are they not leaders?
If we answer to a person who is more like the government protrayed in "1984" always rewriting coporate history, are we to respect them less?
If the owner of a company has a lapse in judgement and indicates that an employee will be the president of the company one day. Do you fault either the owner or the employee for their actions later, that result in the employee leaving? MacBeth and Othello are good examples of Corporations.
You have hit upon a good concept. That corporations are kingdoms with their own approaches, laws, and cultures.
However, these are just off the cuff questions and comments that I had after reading your article.

Craig.

"A leader is never manipulated
A leader remains true to his principles
An effective leader must always embrace a core set of principles.
A leader maintains a sense of humility
A lack of humility within a leader creates a slippery slope that is hard to repair. It is part of a continuum that nearly results in the leader’s destruction:
1. Lack of humility: The leader believes he can do no wrong. Dissent is not encouraged. Some followers may still attempt to exert their opinions, but it is difficult.
2. Arrogance: The leader reacts with scorn and anger at anybody challenging his views. Followers know better than to present alternate points of view.
3. Delusion: The leader believes he is invincible. Evidence to the contrary is ignored or rejected.
4. Destruction: Since the leader is blind to reality, he is not even aware as his empire crumbles around him. The few remaining followers are not willing to communicate the truth.

Are there Leaders anymore? I can not think of one person in a power postiion that meets any of the critera you have set up.

Only one man in a thousand is a leader of men...The other 999 follow women.
- Groucho Marx

Well, this is what came to mind after reading your post. :D

Thanks for the read. I try to never read anything I write, until external auditors make me :o

Both your quote and the MacBeth piece makes me think of:

"He that hath wife and children hath given hostages to fortune; for they are impediments to great enterprises, either of virtue or mischief."

From Sir Frances Bacon's Essay VIII: Of Marriage And Single Life.

I encourage Craig to write an article about Machiavelli and quality leadership. Now that would be fun!

--QG

Patahaconsulting,

You bring up excellent points and questions. I enjoy drawing parallels between Shakespeare’s tragic heroes and leadership because the heroes are so un-leaderly. You can basically do the opposite of what they do in most cases and you would probably perform okay as a leader. I think that's why the characters are so compelling: because they have such profound and intriguing flaws. Even good leaders usually have a number of flaws that constantly threaten to derail them. I guess the trick is managing flaws and character defects. A truly perfect leader wouldn't lead any anybody (not me, anyway). Who could be inspired by absolute perfection? Vomit. By the way, I think you might have pointed me toward Julius Caesar for an exploration of leadership. Thanks...!

Muleskinner,

What a great Groucho quote! Now that was a man possessed of truth and vision. Hey, I just thought of something: could Groucho Marx be a model of leadership? He more or less led Harpo and Chico. He jerked the chains of many others. This is an idea that might have legs.

Goddess,

Your Machiavelli idea is a good one. I just need to get through The Prince. I've never been able to read it all the way through. I just pulled out my copy from the shelf, though. Maybe it will inspire me to become a tyrant!

Hope everyone had a good weekend,
Craig

Muleskinner,

What a great Groucho quote! Now that was a man possessed of truth and vision. Hey, I just thought of something: could Groucho Marx be a model of leadership? He more or less led Harpo and Chico. He jerked the chains of many others. This is an idea that might have legs.

Goddess,

Your Machiavelli idea is a good one. I just need to get through The Prince. I've never been able to read it all the way through. I just pulled out my copy from the shelf, though. Maybe it will inspire me to become a tyrant!

Hope everyone had a good weekend,
Craig
I think a Groucho theme might work out as a good crowd pleaser while delivering the educational message. Certainly worth considering.

Macchiavelli and The Prince
Thus said, I now have to dig out my copy if it is still around and reread to keep up! I guess I was too much of a political animal - I couldn't put it down once I started back in the JFK/LBJ era. I was able to draw real life parallels with modern politicians, dictators, and pretenders to the throne! It was like reading a Harold Robbins roman à clef based on politicians in the headlines!


See - the idea is already increasing the educational quotient of the Cove!

What a great Groucho quote! Now that was a man possessed of truth and vision. Hey, I just thought of something: could Groucho Marx be a model of leadership? He more or less led Harpo and Chico. He jerked the chains of many others. This is an idea that might have legs.

Craig

Best Known as: Mustachioed leader of the Marx Brothers
a.k.a.: Ringleader of the Marx Brothers group routines, cracking wise and waggling his eyebrows over his signature greasepaint moustache.

IMO, one must have been a true leader to get their likeness printed on money. :agree1: The Marx Brothers were a quality act! :tg:

"The Groucho "One Dollar" Bill (http://www.anycities.com/lydiaolydia/marxdollar02.jpg)

I think a Groucho theme might work out as a good crowd pleaser while delivering the educational message. Certainly worth considering.

Macchiavelli and The Prince
Thus said, I now have to dig out my copy if it is still around and reread to keep up! I guess I was too much of a political animal - I couldn't put it down once I started back in the JFK/LBJ era. I was able to draw real life parallels with modern politicians, dictators, and pretenders to the throne! It was like reading a Harold Robbins roman à clef based on politicians in the headlines!


See - the idea is already increasing the educational quotient of the Cove!

"Everyone understands how praiseworthy it is for a prince to remain true to his word and to live with complete integrity without any scheming. However, we've seen through experience how many princes in our time have achieved great things who have little cared about keeping their word and have shrewdly known the skill of tricking the minds of men; these princes have overcome those whose actions were founded on honesty and integrity." Machiavelli's - The Prince

To be expected when raised and tutored by centaur Chiron. :read:

"say the secret woid and win a hunnert dollars!"

As much as I loved the movies of the brothers, Groucho's TV show (he needed the money!) was wonderful!

I remember the Swedish maid/au pair saying she worked for the "Mr. and his mistress."
Groucho said nothing for a long pause, then turned to the camera and did an eyebrow thing. Pandemonium reigned!

There is also the story, perhaps apocryphal, about a contestant on "You Bet Your Life" who had 10 children. Groucho is is said to have expressed surprise. "Ten children! Why so many?" he asked. The contestant rather sheepishly replied, "I don't know...I guess I just love my wife," to which Groucho immediately responded, "I love my cigar too, but I take it out once in a while."

"say the secret woid and win a hunnert dollars!"

As much as I loved the movies of the brothers, Groucho's TV show (he needed the money!) was wonderful!

I remember the Swedish maid/au pair saying she worked for the "Mr. and his mistress."
Groucho said nothing for a long pause, then turned to the camera and did an eyebrow thing. Pandemonium reigned!

...And to think that at one time in his life Groucho wanted to pursue his dream of becoming a doctor. At any rate Groucho and his brothers had their heyday. :2cents:

"Everyone understands how praiseworthy it is for a prince to remain true to his word and to live with complete integrity without any scheming. However, we've seen through experience how many princes in our time have achieved great things who have little cared about keeping their word and have shrewdly known the skill of tricking the minds of men; these princes have overcome those whose actions were founded on honesty and integrity." Machiavelli's - The Prince

:

Nice quote. I was joking a bit with Craig on the post about Machiavelli. Especially because so many corporations are victims of their own excesses and scheming. However, on seeing this quote, and the bolded part, I am thinking that this could be pretty funny. How easy it would be to pick up a few hundred "lack of integrity" and "scheming" examples in corporate America. I can picture it now -- an alternate to Dilbert -- the Quality Prince, bedecked in his finery, with a Q (quality) shield crest and carrying a cause and effect sword. The prince could foil the plans of scheming managers by implementing root cause analysis, teaching management to make decisions based on data, implementing preventive action methods, linking strategic planning with improvement, etc. It could get a cult following and become as popular as Mr. Pareto Head and Attack of the Killer Tomatoes.

Y'know, when you're dreaming, why not dream big??

--QG

Nice quote. I was joking a bit with Craig on the post about Machiavelli. Especially because so many corporations are victims of their own excesses and scheming. However, on seeing this quote, and the bolded part, I am thinking that this could be pretty funny. How easy it would be to pick up a few hundred "lack of integrity" and "scheming" examples in corporate America. I can picture it now -- an alternate to Dilbert -- the Quality Prince, bedecked in his finery, with a Q (quality) shield crest and carrying a cause and effect sword. The prince could foil the plans of scheming managers by implementing root cause analysis, teaching management to make decisions based on data, implementing preventive action methods, linking strategic planning with improvement, etc. It could get a cult following and become as popular as Mr. Pareto Head and Attack of the Killer Tomatoes.

Y'know, when you're dreaming, why not dream big??

--QG

:lmao: Start a new thread, and I'll come out to play. LOL We must keep our sense of humor you know. Of course you do...I'm preaching to the choir here. :bonk:

ccochran,

Thanks for the read and comments. Depending on what level you are looking for with your works on leadership, I would think El Cid would be worth an examination.

This would be more for a lesson for someone who is not going to rule the company, but still needs to lead toward the goals of the company.

by the by my name is Craig as well.

ccochran,

This would be more for a lesson for someone who is not going to rule the company, but still needs to lead toward the goals of the company.



Now that's what I'm talkin' about...Brilliant idea! :applause: