I read some posts about an automotive makers database for suppliers of electronics that have to comply with RoHS. Can I get some more information? Right now, I am looking for a tool that I can use to convert bills of materials for circuit boards to lead free components and circuit boards that have the right kind of flame retardant. I thought we could just go to the contract house and ask their engineers to go through the BOM and convert it. It won't be that easy.

Thoughts, help, are appreciated!

Are you looking to actually change your product or just investigate its makeup? I might be able to help you with some options out there as my organization MDSMap helps company's in complying with legislation such as RoHS, WEEE, ELV and REACH.

Can you describe in a little more detail what you want to do? Also are you supplying the automotive market or the electronics market? The reason I ask is that if your products full under the ELV Directive they are exept from WEEE and RoHS. ELV requires the elimination of Lead Mercury Cadmium and Hexavalent Chromium but it does not touch the Brominated Flame Retardants.

Feel free to contact me if I can be of help.

Chris Harden
MDSMap

Are you looking to actually change your product or just investigate its makeup?

Can you describe in a little more detail what you want to do? Also are you supplying the automotive market or the electronics market? The reason I ask is that if your products full under the ELV Directive they are exept from WEEE and RoHS. ELV requires the elimination of Lead Mercury Cadmium and Hexavalent Chromium but it does not touch the Brominated Flame Retardants.


Chris:

We supply a controller board that is integrated into medical or industrial machines that use a touch screen for communicating between the machine and the human user. So, we're in electronics, and about 1/2 of the business is medical. I read about some of the exemptions, but don't think I know the acronym ELV. Can you point me in the right direction to read more?

Thanks.

You can visit http://www.epmnet.com/consulting.htm#rohs
Or contact RoHS@epmnet.com

Chris:

We supply a controller board that is integrated into medical or industrial machines that use a touch screen for communicating between the machine and the human user. So, we're in electronics, and about 1/2 of the business is medical. I read about some of the exemptions, but don't think I know the acronym ELV. Can you point me in the right direction to read more?

Thanks.

I'm not Chris - but I can help...ELV stands for "End-of-Life Vehicles" - it was a European Union directive. The IMDS database (International Material Data Systems) database was put into place in order to keep track of each and every component that is used in a vehicle - so that when the vehicle dies and goes to car heaven, we have a record of what materials were used to make it (and what materials could potentially be harmful to the environment, the community, etc. etc. etc.). Basically, say I provide you with a circuit board for the car's computer. My IMDS record for the circuit board would list all the components that I use to make said board, and their relative weights; I am required to disclose all contents of the product, within certain limits. I MUST disclose hazardous ingredients (i.e., lead solder, maybe?). Then, for the circuit board itself - well, we buy that from a supplier - so he may be asked to submit a report to explain what his circuit board is made of. It's all a big convoluted web. In the end, you publish your record - and you can make it public, or viewable to only certain recipients at certain companies.

If you're not in automotive, I don't see why you would need to deal with the ELV - or the IMDS.

Cheers - hope this helps,
-R.

hi Q-G,
Everyone in the electronics world is going through this right now. Every component manufacturer is working on lead-free components. Don't forget lead-free solder, which in many cases requires a whole new soldering process, that also has to be validated.

Does your contract manufacturer buy the components for you? Or do you supply them?

If they provide them, I would pass this requirement on to them. You won't be the only one asking, believe me. They also should tell you where they are with leadless solder. There are multiple options, your engineers should decide if what the sub-contractor is doing meets your needs.

If you're supplying the components, I would take your BOM and go to each of your suppliers and ask them if the components on the board are available in a lead-free version. most of these folks have been working on ROHS and WEEE for years now and should be pretty far along.

You should qualify all these new parts at the board level, at a minimum. Don't know how deep your Engineering group is, but being a medical device manufacturer, you probably should go right down to the component level.

Do you have customer requirements driving this? If so, they may require you to validate that the components are lead free. This is where a database of tested product by manufacturer would be real helpful, as I mentioned in a post on ROHS about two years ago. http://elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=6526&highlight=ROHS

Thanks for the various links and information. I sloughing through all this stuff. I think I am at a point where it all makes sense. Now just one more question for those of you experts out there. Tell me if this makes sense. For the un-initiated, we sell circuit boards or IC's with our firmware to various OEM's. These boards or chips control specific computer peripherals.

1. I have data from the manufacturer of each component to show the RoHS compliance (test reports,TCLP's, or conformance statements).
2. I have converted our Bills of materials so our contract house can supply RoHS compliant products to us for sale.
3. I created a conformance document that states to our customers that our manufacturer's have told us they are RoHS compliant. Our company does not alter the product in any way that would compromise this compliance.

With that conformance document, have I prepared our company properly to state that our products are RoHS compliant?

As an aside, I am starting to get requests for Product Spec sheets (basically results of ingredient testing). I will take these from the manufacturer's websites and provide them to our customers.

...have I prepared our company properly to state that our products are RoHS compliant?

Jodi,

All I've been doing is writing letters (of certification, I suppose) that state that "Product XXX is/is not RoHS compliant". That's been fine for our customers - that's been all they need. Some customers had specific forms or packages for us to complete - so we did.

One thing to note, though, is that the legislation is changing. Right now the legislation still legally states a tolerance limit of 0%. The proposed limits are currently before the European Commission, but have not been made official yet...acceptance of the changes to the tolerances will increase most of them to 0.1% (not all of them, but i can't remember which ones are different).

Cheers,
-R.

Jodi,

You do have the just of RoHS Compliance. Be prepared for the fact that many of your customers will likely be asking for some form of material content disclosure ranging from full disclosure for some companies to disclosing against the JIG A and JIG B lists for others.

IPC is currently working on a standardized form for material content disclosure. If this is standardized you will likely have to provide some information on this form for many of your customers.

If you have any more questions please feel free to contact me.

Thanks,

Chris Harden

Thanks for all the information. Yes, I am now being asked for material content. A couple of suppliers have what I need, and a couple don't. This is certainly a project I didn't know I would inherit! I will just keep plugging away.

This is a great directive for Test Labs.

Do check the mdsystems database because you may find material test data there, even though it is primarily an auditomotive site.

Good luck...in my opinion, this is an engineering project not a QA one.

Good luck...in my opinion, this is an engineering project not a QA one.

Rosie,

From a quality perspective I'm concerned about the fact that "acceptable" solder joints look like what we used to refer to as "cold" joints, plus factors such as solder pads/lands are no longer being filled as they were with Pb/Sn solder (all factors that are going to require a re-training of personnel). Then there are the reliability issues such as: tin whiskers, tin pests, intermetallics forming in the solder pot, etc.

I for one am pleased to be a part of the team looking into the impact of this initiative.

I agree that QA should be part of the team, but too many companies dump projects like this in QA and then run. There are too many engineering issues in this directive to dump it all on QA.

The whole world of soldering is changing as we speak. Everyone will be re-learning how to judge solder quality, that's for sure.

I'm one of those quality people on whom the RoHS has been dumped, so this thread has been really helpful so far! (Thank you!)

I'm currently making a list of components that goes into our products and then searching the manufacturer's website for RoHS compliance information. This is easier for some than for others...

My question is, if I have an MSDS that does not include referece to the restricted components, can I then declare that they are in compliance? Or do I need to dig further?

Thanks!

I'm one of those quality people on whom the RoHS has been dumped, so this thread has been really helpful so far! (Thank you!)

I'm currently making a list of components that goes into our products and then searching the manufacturer's website for RoHS compliance information. This is easier for some than for others...

My question is, if I have an MSDS that does not include referece to the restricted components, can I then declare that they are in compliance? Or do I need to dig further?

Thanks!

I'd dig further. What you're assuming here is that the rules for declaration of materials on MSDSs are the same as for RoHS...which is not necessarily the case. For example, general rules in Canada require disclosure of hazardous substances in quantities over 1% (or another threshold as specified). Say you have cadmium in this raw material at 0.75% - it may not be declared on the MSDS, but you would have to declare it as per RoHS guidelines.

These numbers are hypothetical - I don't know what the threshold is for cadmium in Canadian MSDSs. But you get the point. I would dig a little further to ensure that you're not stepping on toes.

Hope this helps - sorry if I just made more work for you!
Cheers,
-R.

It's not you making more work for me! :) Thanks for your help!!

Quality Queen,

You definitely will want to dig further. MSDSs are focused on products that present a hazard to worker health and therefore often do not disclose chemicals imbedded in products. RoHS is concerned with the six hazardous chemicals if they are present anywhere.

Chris Harden
MDSMap A service to Tetra Tech

Hello Quality Queen from the Quality Goddess -- perhaps our 'rich' blood is related somehow!

Regarding digging deeper, I have found that electronics component suppliers are giving me access to Materials Declarations on their websites. These have been extremely helpful for determining if the homogenous parts are RoHS compliant or not. They usually contain results of actual testing by a lab for the 6 materials listed in RoHS.