There was a comment by one of our Covers in the ASQ Living Strategy page (http://www.asq.org/cgi-bin/guestbook/guestbook.cgi) that the Cover's ASQ certifications were about to lapse.

I am intimately aware that Continuing Education Units may be earned toward recertification by merely attending monthly Section meetings and publishing articles which may or may not have anything to do with the topic of one's certification.

I am prompted to ask how many of you who already hold ASQ certifications (which enabled you to get your current job) would be terminated by your employer if you failed to maintain the certification? Do your employers keep track of your certification status and ask for proof of status at regular intervals?

If you employ folks who got the job because of their certification, would you fire them if they let the certification lapse? Why did you answer that way?

Note this inquiry is separate and apart from certifications required to be a third party auditor for a registrar.

I earned my CQT in 1987 after a few years in the field. At the time I was bright eyed and bushy tailed and all was well in the world of quality control. (not assurance yet) In my mind the CQT would open doors for future growth and at least get me a raise. Upon certification my Supervisor gave me a $5.00/week raise. Oh well, I was low paid at the time anyways.

The CCQT never came up in discussion again. Maybe because the QCT is one of the lower certifications it was a moot point during my career. It never overtly helped or hindered me. I have been blessed in that I went from 1 job seemlessly into another with minimal use of formal resumes and interviews. Over the years I had a good networking structure where we all pretty much new each other and followed each other around to greener pastures and endeavors.

That was the winded way to say certifications are good but in our choosen path there are more important methods of securing and retaining employment.

Al...

I received my CQE in 1989 and my CRE in 1997. The acquisition of both were actively encouraged by my current employers (at the time). For subsequent jobs, the certifications were a significant factor in their choosing me. As part of the hiring agreements, they offered to pay for all of the training / seminars necessary to maintain the certifications.

Afterwards, however, during the terms of employment, they simply trusted me to maintain them without further tracking. As to whether they would keep me or fire me, after a certain period of time my continued employment was/is based on performance more than the cert (the price of admission).

When hiring personnel for quality positions, I look at more than just a certification, but the cert is a significant factor. I've always looked at the acquisition of a CQE or CQT as an important knowledge foundation. When I've hired people without it, it became a condition of their hire that they acquire it within a specific period of time. Fortunately, I've had good, qualified people, and only had to let one go.

I received the CQT in '94, CQM in '97 and CRE, in '98. The CQT I did on my own and the others I was compensated (had to pass) by the employer. I have not kept them current and really saw no benefit in employment from them. I thought the knowledge gained was worth it.

got my cqe (1992-paid by employer) and cqa (2001-made a bet with my boss that i can pass the exam without studying and the winning was more than enough to cover the exam fee) but i no longer maintain them for i see no use for them...if employer wants me to have cqe/cqa and is willing to pay for them, i have no problem writing the exams again.

btw, am planning to write cre this december, if my boss is willing to bet again!!!!....will see!!!

I think the exercise of preparing for the exams (especially the CQE, my CQMgr experience I have discussed elsewhere) was well worth the effort. I keep my certs current because things I would do anyway count. (As an aside I wonder if there is a way to get credit for the Cove?). But, the recertification fee seems high to me. What does ASQ do to earn it? The paperwork is reviewed by the sections, right?

I don't think my employer cares about certification one way or another.

Maintaining the certification isn't the right question. Continually learning something new in order to stay viable in today's fast-moving world is. If you do the latter the former is a cinch.

My point was not whether the individual remains competent in the field, either through practice or continual education, but whether the actual certification is required to be maintained for continued employment.

I, for example, don't currently retain certification in any field through choice, not inaction or laziness. That does not mean that I don't gain the pile of blue slips attesting to CEU buildup - I just don't apply for certification and/or recertification - the presence or absence of a current certification hasn't arisen in 20 years.

Having a CQA was probably a plus when I landed my current position. I have maintained it, and actually even went to an RAB lead auditor course on my own for professional advancement. I'm currently " in the market" so to speak, and a lot of the positions I see specify either CQE or more commonly six sigma certification. So, right now those 2 certifications appear to be entry cards.

That said, my current employer doesn't require that I maintain the CQA, nor have I had any past employer require that I achieve or maintain an ASQ certification.

Personally, I'd sooner maintain the certification than have to retake the test - loss of a good Saturday to retake, versus some occasional time spent annually to maintain it.

I am interested in the answer to Wes' question. I am looking at taking the CQA. This is to try for those position that pay more than more current one and require a CQA cert.
I had not thought beyond that point.
Is there anyone out there that has to maintain their Cert. to ratain their position?

also, if publishing is part of it do people just rework previous articles and get them published? It seems that I have read some of these articles before, different author - same message.


Thanks,
Craig.

Golly! I hope they are not guilty of plagiarism. The weird part is that ASQ gives same ceu (or RU - recertification units) for a guy who publishes a small article in the Section newsletter as for a guy like Allan Sayle, who publishes a world-recognized textbook on a topic.
Here's the ceu/RU dope:
Recertification by RU credits is a simple process of obtaining a minimum of 18 recertification units (RUs) within your three-year certification period. You may accumulate the 18 RU credits from professional activities that either increase your knowledge of the Body of Knowledge (BOK) or is job enhancing.
To receive the employment RU credits, at least one area of your job duties, responsibilities, and/or functions must fall in at least one area of your certification(s) Body of Knowledge (BOK). Then other category activities must fall in either one area of the certification(s) BOK or be directly job enhancing.

You can download the recertification journal from ASQ to see how it all works:
http://www.asq.org/cert/recert/rucredits/recert_journal_app.pdf (427K)

Check with your local Section - there is always at least one guy who is super savvy about organizing RUs to be in sync so folks with multiple certs can be as efficient as possible in gathering RUs.

We seem to go in circles on the value of certifications. I believe we have had similar questions in discussions about obtaining employment. If it helps you get past the gatekeeper, why not do it?

ASQ is not the only organization that pushes certifications and makes money off of them. Once a professional engineer, teacher or nurse is licensed, recertification units are required to maintain the license. The main difference is that a governmental agency requires the license to be maintained to continue in the profession. The value of the recertifications is also questionable for these professionals once they have experience. Maybe the better question is: Do we want the government to license us as quality professionals?

If the answer is yes, than should we grandfather people like Wes based on experience?

Bill Pflanz

I do not believe that it is plagiarism that is occurring. In part is the pressure of having to publish and in part is ignorance that that particular subject has been addressed.
I find in my research for a direction that I believe is unique that just a research that the subject has already been addressed. In my case, it is usually better written. Similar to what I find on this site. Looking back far enough, it has been addressed and usually better written.
However, I do know of a case where someone a couple years ago was given recognization for the same approach that a former boss had published in 1984 in a now defunct magazine.

O.K., so the cert will get you into the door. But if you do not retain the cert is there a trapdoor to remove you?

Craig. - still very interested in an answer to the orignal questiion.

There was a comment by one of our Covers in the ASQ Living Strategy page (http://www.asq.org/cgi-bin/guestbook/guestbook.cgi) that the Cover's ASQ certifications were about to lapse.

I am intimately aware that Continuing Education Units may be earned toward recertification by merely attending monthly Section meetings and publishing articles which may or may not have anything to do with the topic of one's certification.

I am prompted to ask how many of you who already hold ASQ certifications (which enabled you to get your current job) would be terminated by your employer if you failed to maintain the certification? Do your employers keep track of your certification status and ask for proof of status at regular intervals?

If you employ folks who got the job because of their certification, would you fire them if they let the certification lapse? Why did you answer that way?

Note this inquiry is separate and apart from certifications required to be a third party auditor for a registrar.

Last year we recruited an individual as a Quality Engineer. The job requirement did ask for CSQE and CRE. This individual had passed these exams in the past but did not recertify after 3 years. I don’t think our hiring manager was very concerned about that. That individual had the required skill set, relevant experience and evidence that he/she had already passed the exam. That was sufficient to offer a job.

I am due for recertification myself in couple of months! Recertification log is very general in nature. It is not difficult at all. It does not ask you acquire only Software related job, training, etc for CSQE and Reliability job, training for CRE. (courses need to cover atleast one area of BOK).The recertification merely ensures that one is touch with the overall quality & reliability field continually. This is not necessarily the best way to recertify.

Also this is not bad method.
If an individual passes the CRE exam and later moved on run a grocery store. Further there has been no touch with the subject through any training or attending seminar /conferences, the recertification scheme will be difficult for this individual. This individual cannot and should not claim as an ASQ certified reliability engineer after expiry.

Hence recertification acts as a filter with moderate protection to reduce the risk to community.

I have come across organizations that consider ASQ certification with respect and as a desired qualification. Since ASQ certification is“peer recognition” and not a licence to perform a job (Professional Engineer designation), I do not think an organization would go that far to fire an employee for letting ASQ certification expire.

Regards,
Govind.