We have our first management review coming up, as required by element 5.6 of the standard. I would like to make this as positive of an experience as possible and was wondering if anyone had a format that has worked well for them - by format I mean layout of the meeting and to frequency.

For starters, see these existing discussion threads: Management Review Forms (http://Elsmar.com/Forums/search.php?do=process&titleonly=1&query=management+review+form)

Other Management Review related discussion theads (http://Elsmar.com/Forums/search.php?do=process&titleonly=1&query=management+review)

This is a post (http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=164353&postcount=12) I put up last week to the SAME question. As Marc has shown a search is very useful for finding this stuff. We seem to have a spate of queries lately for very basic material.

we used the Minutes of The Meeting form instead...where all the concerned personnel and the top management can sign, and where normally the auditor will look for. All concerns of the comapny relating to it's Management system (quality/environment) should be discussed in detail in the minutes.:D

All the key areas needed to do a succesfull meeting are enclosed you mite need to add or remove.

This is a post (http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=164353&postcount=12) I put up last week to the SAME question. As Marc has shown a search is very useful for finding this stuff. We seem to have a spate of queries lately for very basic material.


Forms or documents are not what I am looking for. The input and output requirements are listed in the standard.

I'd like to avoid the attitude that the meeting takes place only to meet ISO requirements and that the people involved have "better things to do." Or that little improvement comes as a result of the meeting. For a first meeting, these are my concerns.

Well it got to do with culture change and also who is leading or championing your ISO process. The meeting should be firstly chaired by your MD as managment must drive the system(leading by example to others). If you dont have the buy in of the MD you can forget having a good first meeting.

What i did before having my first review meeting is to choose only the managers on the front lines to be in the meeting and then to give them quality training on the importance of ISO and what a impact it could have on bussness. Explain to them the positives of implementing this system and the objectives you company wishes to achieve.

In a review meeting i prepare all the stats and give everybody a list of things of relevance are to be brought to the meeting. and the review minutes are their ask for input. usually if the MD is there most poeople will be there.

Thanks Sheldon. That was another question I had was who to include. We are a smaller company and have a few basic areas- Directors (3 of them), customer service and sales (about 5), shop managers (about 5, who still work in the warehouse), and warehouse employees. I am not sure how many and who to include.

Thanks Sheldon. That was another question I had was who to include. We are a smaller company and have a few basic areas- Directors (3 of them), customer service and sales (about 5), shop managers (about 5, who still work in the warehouse), and warehouse employees. I am not sure how many and who to include.

As long as they all can provide valuable information, have them all attend, in my opinion. :)

I'm in the mood to stir the pot a little (probably because I'm away for the next few days and will avoid any fallout)...

Who says that Management Review has to be a meeting? Who says that Management Review has to be one meeting?

Newsletter articles could work if done properly...you'll need some way of identifying actions generated, however. Or have several meetings, at various levels, which focus on those topics meaningful to the audience (and in their language).

I'm in the mood to stir the pot a little (probably because I'm away for the next few days and will avoid any fallout)...

Newsletter articles could work if done properly...you'll need some way of identifying actions generated, however. Or have several meetings, at various levels, which focus on those topics meaningful to the audience (and in their language).

I have never looked at it in this perspective.

But could some of the company sensitive information be in jeopardy if a news letter was used? I guess I am not thinking that it could be left out :notme: :bonk:

Who says that Management Review has to be a meeting? Who says that Management Review has to be one meeting?

There isn't anything that I am aware of that requires a meeting. It only says that the QMS will be reviewed by Top Management.

But could some of the company sensitive information be in jeopardy if a news letter was used? I guess I am not thinking that it could be left out :notme: :bonk:

No need to :bonk: ... in fact, I was tasked with writing the Management Committee's front page article for our upcoming newsletter. After developing an article, I was informed that it did not follow the proper "etiquette". There were do's and don't's that I was to adhere to for the exact reason you've said.

Ironically, I'm allow to talk about employee involvement in the management system, but I can not talk about the management system. :confused:

There isn't anything that I am aware of that requires a meeting. It only says that the QMS will be reviewed by Top Management.

True...combining this element, however, with the aspects of communication and you have an awesomely effective medium for talking about your management system! To everyone! :D

We have crew meetings where crews talk about their performance and how they impacted the department overall - management may or may not be there, but they review the outputs.

We have department meetings where department progress is discussed - management attends.

We have monthly operations review where company progress is discussed along with how everything ties into our business case and our "definitions of success".

We have management systems reviews...a summary, in essence, of all meetings as well as the mandatory "stuff", and a strong focus on upcoming changes, resource requireemnts and general improvement initiatives.

Good out of the box thinking but it seems hard enough having a meeting, why do newsletter articles? Im not even sure how that would be a review. The various levels could work. Worth thinking about.

Forms or documents are not what I am looking for. The input and output requirements are listed in the standard.

I'd like to avoid the attitude that the meeting takes place only to meet ISO requirements and that the people involved have "better things to do." Or that little improvement comes as a result of the meeting. For a first meeting, these are my concerns.
I think you should cancel the meeting until everyone has the right attitude. It sounds like no matter what you do it will be a failure. My procedure does not just espouse the standard (read my posts I hate the standard and avoid it at all costs) it shows what OUR business does. I never mention the standard and open every meeting with a run down of the business KPIs and achievements. this MR is something that should reflect the BUSINESS not the standard and that is how you have to sell it to them. The KPIs of this meeting should reflect the KPIs of the business not of just quality. Here are my favourite two presentations to change people from just thinking about QA and get them concentrate on the BUSINESS. They are good for all levels of the company!!! The first is Apes and Culture (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=709&d=1049176962)and shows the need for change and culture. The second is an exercise/lesson in what a QMS system (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=2176&d=1085445550)is all about and why we need it. Old timers here will know that I recommend these two presentations a lot but I really believe in them and they get everyone to take another look at Quality and how we do things. I also agree a lot with Roxy in that a great deal of our MR is completed before we even have the meeting. KPIs are already discussed at normal weekly and quarterly management meetings. The actual Quality documentation such as Audits and CARs are actioned and discussed at meetings of the auditors and managers. The MR is a review and wrap up of a lot of smaller meetings that control our business.

I've posted my procedure once before:
http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=141854&postcount=59

To go :topic:
Who says that Management Review has to be a meeting? Who says that Management Review has to be one meeting?

I LIKE this question and have often thought of canceling all future MR Meetings but haven't figured out how to go about it in the correct manner. Why cancel? I'm not seeing a benefit of forcing the Team to sit for an hour to discuss required ISO stuff. I conduct the entire meeting and keep it on-track and timely. Sometimes, I can't get them to focus on the meeting - they talk about their other issues in my meeting! Plus, it's annoying for me to see members with ants in their pants to hurry and finish up the meeting so they can (in my opinon) go do something they feel is more important. You should see them fly out of their chairs. One member doesn't even come to the meetings anymore - oh, he's too busy.

There you have it - that's my dirty laundry for the week. I'm frustrated. :frust: :frust: :frust:
That is why I don't even want to have meetings anymore.

Wish I was brave enough to do this......My cinema instructor (college class) one day tried to get the class' attention to start the class, he gave up after a minute or two and said, "Well if you don't want to listen to me, then I don't want to listen to you." and he walked out - gave us all an "F" for the day...regardless of those talking/not talking. (No, I wasn't talking. )

I've posted my procedure once before:
http://elsmar.com/Forums/showpost.php?p=141854&postcount=59IMHO your process is scary and that is why I use a flowchart. I keep the Wi/procedure to a minimum as to not scare off the personnel that use it.

I LIKE this question and have often thought of canceling all future MR Meetings but haven't figured out how to go about it in the correct manner. Why cancel? I'm not seeing a benefit of forcing the Team to sit for an hour to discuss required ISO stuff. I conduct the entire meeting and keep it on-track and timely. Sometimes, I can't get them to focus on the meeting - they talk about their other issues in my meeting! Plus, it's annoying for me to see members with ants in their pants to hurry and finish up the meeting so they can (in my opinon) go do something they feel is more important. You should see them fly out of their chairs. One member doesn't even come to the meetings anymore - oh, he's too busy.
Herein lays your problem. I don't promote our MR as a purely ISO requirement. I push it as a Business meeting where we discuss our business, customers, complaints, processes, waste, improvement and opportunity. I ensure that we talk about money to be gained and money lost. this always gets their attention. They each have KPIs and in order to keep them on track the system must operate in an effective fashion.


There you have it - that's my dirty laundry for the week. I'm frustrated. :frust: :frust: :frust:
That is why I don't even want to have meetings anymore.

Wish I was brave enough to do this......My cinema instructor (college class) one day tried to get the class' attention to start the class, he gave up after a minute or two and said, "Well if you don't want to listen to me, then I don't want to listen to you." and he walked out - gave us all an "F" for the day...regardless of those talking/not talking. (No, I wasn't talking. )

I had a science teacher that said we all needed stimuli. Something to grab our attention. He used a rather large stick that he would bang on his desk. It got our attention every time. I use an AGENDA. The agenda steps people thru what they can expect. It gives them action items that need to be completed and spells out possible avenues for making certain business areas more effective ($$$$). If this fails and people fail to attend then I let the external auditor know what a sham it all is and they take the appropriate action as happened two years ago when we were threatened with losing our certification. I was dragged before management and they wanted to know why this was happening. I told them that they were the problem and if they wanted ISO then they had to develop a way for it to interact as a business tool. We are far progressed now and all management (if they want to or not) ATTEND THIS MEETING.

Once again here are my presentations that I feel people need to see if they are going to change and accept QA for something other than an outside influence. Apes and Culture (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=709&d=1049176962) this deals with why we need to change from what we have always done. I have shown this at BOARD level and received great feedback and the second is What is a QMS (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=709&d=1049176962) We need to get across to people that QA is not a demon it is a requirement much the same as Safety or Environment systems...It is there to protect our business and make it stronger. Here is my basic flowchart for a MR (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1547&d=1068176254) it is simple and straight to the point. It covers what is required but also leaves things open to expansion. We try to steer clear of purely ISO based KPIs such as the length of time CARs are open or how many were closed out. This does not necessarily better our business. We talk about the cost of waste, Customer complaints, NC production, Improvements etc We nee the people present to offer things to the floor and once they are hooked they will attend...be it to defend their position or knock someone else’s down. 'Build it and they will come' is a great line from 'Field of Dreams' but YOU have to build it first!!! They won't come if it is only half built. They need the stimuli. Good luck

IMHO your process is scary and that is why I use a flowchart. I keep the Wi/procedure to a minimum as to not scare off the personnel that use it.

I am the only one that uses it. It is my guide to create an agenda. The agenda gets distributed. But they don't pay attention to it.

Herein lays your problem. I don't promote our MR as a purely ISO requirement. I push it as a Business meeting where we discuss our business, customers, complaints, processes, waste, improvement and opportunity. I ensure that we talk about money to be gained and money lost. this always gets their attention. They each have KPIs and in order to keep them on track the system must operate in an effective fashion.

I'm not in a position to discuss money gain/lost. I am not privy to that info.

I am the only one that uses it. It is my guide to create an agenda. The agenda gets distributed. But they don't pay attention to it.

Mate, I am in no way trying to tell you how to run your business and I do understand the reluctance of some "managers" to get involved. I had the same problems and still do to some extent. As soon as I bring up the words ISO some managers visibly flinch. Our meeting is chaired by the MD and he got a scare when the registrar NC's us for our MRs. I had a word to the registrar and told him that I wanted him to NC us because it was a farce. I took a little pain but the registrar ensured them that it wasn’t my problem it was THEIRS!!! They had to do something about it and the execs did some of the lower managers did not but they have to report and attend.

I'm not in a position to discuss money gain/lost. I am not privy to that info.
I don't discuss money either and at some levels am not privy to the info. I highlight possible savings areas even if I do not know the true cost. A NC costs money and I show it by a representation of units rather than dollars. It has been effective. Here is my 'basic schematic' (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=1868&d=1076373280) . During the first representation I placed figures of $100 per area of loss and it soon added up (I did not know the true costs but mine were waaaay below the actual costs. Managers now have to map out the costs. The Green squares are the normal costs of a conforming product whereas the orange costs are those of the Non Conforming costs. It is effective and these are the things we talk about at MR rather than Document control KPIs etc

Mate, I am in no way trying to tell you how to run your business....

I know. Thanks for your input though. :bigwave:
Now back to the OP.....anyone else have examples to share of their process?

All the key areas needed to do a succesfull meeting are enclosed you mite need to add or remove.

********************
Dear Martin,
can u send me sample format of EMS Mgt. Review Agenda if it is with you?

ABHAY

********************
Dear Martin,
can u send me sample format of EMS Mgt. Review Agenda if it is with you?

ABHAY

The post you're responding to is a year and a half old, and that's also how long since the poster has logged in here, so a response is unlikely. You can do a search of the Cove for the information you're looking for, or perhaps someone else will read this and be able to help. You can start here (http://elsmar.com/Forums/search.php?searchid=1178994).

As a new member to Elsmar Cove, I have found the information here abounds with ideas and helpful discussions. I was able to look at many Management Review Forms and through what I found here, came up with something that works for our organization. Hopefully, some of you out there can use it as well. 10235