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View Full Version : Unskilled and unaware of it: Incompetence can't see itself in a mirror


Jim Wynne
14th November 2006, 02:30 PM
In crawling through the series of tubes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_of_tubes), I came across a fascinating article from the American Psychological Association entitled, Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments (http://www.apa.org/journals/features/psp7761121.pdf). (PDF) The paper, coauthored by Justin Kruger and David Dunning of Cornell University, is described thusly in the its abstract:
People tend to hold overly favorable views of their abilities in many social and intellectual domains. The authors suggest that this overestimation occurs, in part, because people who are unskilled in these domains suffer a dual burden: Not only do these people reach erroneous conclusions and make unfortunate choices, but their incompetence robs them of the metacognitive ability to realize it. Across 4 studies, the authors found that participants scoring in the bottom quartile on tests of humor, grammar, and logic grossly overestimated their test performance and ability. Although their test scores put them in the 12th percentile, they estimated themselves to be in the 62nd. Several analyses linked this miscalibration to deficits in metacognitive skill, or the capacity to distinguish accuracy from error. Paradoxically, improving the skills of participants, and thus increasing their metacognitive competence, helped them recognize the limitations of their abilities.

It's a fascinating, very accessible read, and explains a phenomenon we've all seen at one time or another: the clueless boss (or other bothersome coworker) who is so incompetent that he can't understand how incompetent he is. The authors suggest that the reason for the phenomenon is that the skills required to achieve competence are the same ones necessary to evaluate it:
In essence, we argue that the skills that engender competence in
a particular domain are often the very same skills necessary to
evaluate competence in that domain—one's own or anyone else's.
Because of this, incompetent individuals lack what cognitive psychologists variously term metacognition (Everson & Tobias, 1998), metamemory (Klin, Guizman, & Levine, 1997), metacomprehension (Maki, Jonas, & Kallod, 1994), or self-monitoring skills (Chi, Glaser, & Rees, 1982). These terms refer to the ability to know how well one is performing, when one is likely to be accurate in judgment, and when one is likely to be in error. For
example, consider the ability to write grammatical English. The skills that enable one to construct a grammatical sentence are the same skills necessary to recognize a grammatical sentence, and thus are the same skills necessary to determine if a grammatical mistake has been made. In short, the same knowledge that underlies the ability to produce correct judgment is also the knowledge that underlies the ability to recognize correct judgment. To lack the former is to be deficient in the latter.

ScottK
14th November 2006, 02:40 PM
thanks Jim (where's the "thanks" button?)

I'm going to read this right now.

Jim Wynne
14th November 2006, 02:44 PM
thanks Jim (where's the "thanks" button?)

I'm going to read this right now.

The Coffee Break forum is "thankless.":D

RCBeyette
14th November 2006, 02:47 PM
I think we've just described my exhusband. ;)

SteelMaiden
14th November 2006, 02:52 PM
I think we've just described my exhusband. ;)
Oh bloody **** there goes another keyboard. Is there a place where all the incompetent but egotistical exes go?:lmao:

Wes Bucey
14th November 2006, 03:10 PM
Oh bloody **** there goes another keyboard. :lmao:Was it coffee or Pepsi? Spill or blow through the nose?:notme:

Wes Bucey
14th November 2006, 03:13 PM
In crawling through the series of tubes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_of_tubes), I came across a fascinating article from the American Psychological Association entitled, Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One's Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments (http://www.apa.org/journals/features/psp7761121.pdf). (PDF) The paper, coauthored by Justin Kruger and David Dunning of Cornell University, is described thusly in the its abstract:


It's a fascinating, very accessible read, and explains a phenomenon we've all seen at one time or another: the clueless boss (or other bothersome coworker) who is so incompetent that he can't understand how incompetent he is. The authors suggest that the reason for the phenomenon is that the skills required to achieve competence are the same ones necessary to evaluate it:I guess this is proof of the contention of Dilbert creator Scott Adams (http://www.unitedmedia.com/comics/dilbert/) that the pointy-haired boss is real!

ScottK
14th November 2006, 03:15 PM
The Coffee Break forum is "thankless.":D

I guess I just showed my incomeptence

moving right along...

Where is the "thanks" button, anyway?

SteelMaiden
14th November 2006, 03:30 PM
I guess I just showed my incomeptence

moving right along...

Where is the "thanks" button, anyway?
No, really, there is no thanks button in the coffee break forums, it really is thankless. (because there is no adding to your Karma in the "non-business" side of the Cove)

BradM
14th November 2006, 03:39 PM
Agree, or disagree; love it or hate it. One thing I have always admired about decent psychological journals is how good they do on their experimental design and rigor.

David Bear
14th November 2006, 03:48 PM
I'm great at everything I think I'm great at doing! At least I think I am! Of course my wife usually points out to me that I am wrong on whatever I think.:confused:

I do know that I have ample opportunities for improvement.:bonk:

SteelMaiden
14th November 2006, 03:53 PM
well, if you do not know whether or not you are incompetent, you don't have any teenagers around to set you straight. :whip: Believe me, I have discovered how truly incabable I am of doing anything right since the young'uns became teenagers. :frust:

errhine
14th November 2006, 03:57 PM
well, if you do not know whether or not you are incompetent, you don't have any teenagers around to set you straight. :whip: Believe me, I have discovered how truly incabable I am of doing anything right since the young'uns became teenagers. :frust:

But isn't it amazing how smart your parents started to become once you hit 25 or so?

:bonk:

SteelMaiden
14th November 2006, 03:59 PM
actually, i never really thought mine were incompetent, just very naive. they never really got over that, but yes they did get smarter as they aged. ;)

little__cee
14th November 2006, 04:31 PM
I'm smart enough to know that there's a lot I don't know!

Seriously, this article gives me hope about my math ability. I know enough to know when I've done something wrong, which according to this means I'm NOT as bad as the math challenged individuals who think that they're right when they're actually wrong. At least I realize that I'm wrong...and I guess that's a good thing!?!

Claes Gefvenberg
16th November 2006, 11:24 AM
This thread fits right in with a little gem I found today: How men regard their own driving skills (http://elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?p=172897#post172897).

/Claes

Icy Mountain
17th November 2006, 04:00 PM
well, if you do not know whether or not you are incompetent, you don't have any teenagers around to set you straight. :whip: Believe me, I have discovered how truly incabable I am of doing anything right since the young'uns became teenagers. :frust:When I was 14 my father was so ignorant that I couldn't stand to have the old man around, when I turned 21 I was astonished at what the old man had learned in 7 years.I though I was wrong once but I was mistaken.

My oldest son is 14 but I have not yet begun to suffer from blinding ignorance. Maybe I'll get lucky. Then again, he's not in high school yet.

I sent this card to my father on the Father's Day after I graduated from college (because I was amazed at how much he had learned while I was away at university).
Man to Bartender: Kids these days, you just talk and talk and it just goes in one ear and out the other.
Bartender: Yeah, I know what you mean.
Inside of Card: Dad, thanks for all the stuff that stayed in the middle. Signed #1 son.

I got this in some management seminar:
You know what you know: Consciously competent
You know what you don't know: Consciously incompetent
You don't know what you know: Unconsciously competent
You don't know what you don't know: Unconsciously incompetent
The point being that only the last one is truly dangerous to project teams and natural teams. The others are all useful.

harry
17th November 2006, 08:45 PM
I got this in some management seminar:
You know what you know: Consciously competent
You know what you don't know: Consciously incompetent
You don't know what you know: Unconsciously competent
You don't know what you don't know: Unconsciously incompetent
The point being that only the last one is truly dangerous to project teams and natural teams. The others are all useful.

That's the concept of 'Johari Window' applied to the subject of competency, Icy.
For those interested in 'Johari Window', here's a link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johari_window

Regards