[Now this question is telling how well we know our customer base, and I understand that we have this weakness.]

When grappling with what to do concerning the new SI for 7.4.1.2, Supplier Quality Management System Development, and possibly making a distinction between Automotive and Non-Automotive (ISO Certification VS. TS Certification) my current management gave the impression that our registrar was not interested in our customers who primarily provide 'service parts' as opposed to 'production parts.' I was surprised with this position, so thought I would ask my fellow covers if there is any truth to this thinking. I would think that the TS scope would cover both production and service parts- right? I mean most of the CSRs for record retention of Part Approvals, Tooling Records, and Purchase Orders is "for the length of time that the part (or family of parts) is active for production and service requirements plus one calendar year."

Am I wrong?

Thanks,
Doug

Try looking at TS 7.5.1.8 Service agreement with customer
"When there is a service agreement with the customer, the organization shall verify the effectiveness of
-any organization service centers
-any special-purpose tools or measurement equipment, and
-the training of service personnel"

This may help you decide.

We don't have any service parts, so haven't had to confront the interpretation.

Try looking at TS 7.5.1.8 Service agreement with customer
"When there is a service agreement with the customer, the organization shall verify the effectiveness of
-any organization service centers
-any special-purpose tools or measurement equipment, and
-the training of service personnel"

This may help you decide.

We don't have any service parts, so haven't had to confront the interpretation.

Thanks, but that service would be for either production or service parts - right?

Doug

I would think that is correct since there should be no difference in parts quality or process controls and parts can be shipped directly to the customer or the service distribution location.

Years ago in the 70's companies would always keep parts set aside which were not up to customer requirements, to ship as "service" parts. The reason was that they fiqured that the parts were going to end up at dealers, and they were not as picky and would work the parts to fit and finish needs. Mostly that was a correct assumption.
Those days are long gone and both type products require the same standards.

Doug - quick question for you- to whom to you supply service parts?

It is my understanding that "service parts" refers to parts/materials that go to dealers or other distribution centers for vehicle maintenance & repair; e.g. muffler systems, catalytic converters, distributor caps, etc.

Anyone - please advise if this definition is not correct.

I am not sure how 7.4.1.2 fits into your question about your customers.

Does the following FAQ from the IAOB / IATF website help? It appears to me that the manufacture of service parts for cars, trucks, buses and motorcycles could be within your or your customer's TS scope.


ISO/TS 16949:2002 Frequently Asked Questions (TS FAQs)

IATF communicated FAQs are clarifications of existing requirements. They are not new requirements, thus the original requirements should form the basis for reporting any noncompliance and not the FAQs.

Applicability/Scope
Question: Which Organizations can obtain Certification/Registration to ISO/TS 16949:2002?

Answer: Any Organization in the Automotive Supply Chain meeting the criteria below can obtain Certification to ISO/TS 16949:2002

1. Scope 1.1 General
- This Technical Specification, in conjunction with ISO 9001:2000, defines the quality management system requirements for the design and development, production and, when relevant, installation and service of automotive-related products.
- This Technical Specification is applicable to sites of the organization where production and/or service parts specified by the customer are manufactured.

2. "Automotive" shall be understood as including the following:
- Cars, Trucks (Light, Medium and Heavy), Buses, Motorcycles

3. "Automotive" shall be understood to exclude the following:
- Industrial, Agricultural, Off-Highway (Mining, Forestry, Construction, etc.)

4. 3.1.11 "Site"
- Location at which value added manufacturing processes occur.

5. “Manufacturing”
- Process of making or fabricating:
Production materials
Production or service parts
Assemblies, or
Heat treating, welding, painting, plating, or other finishing services


http://www.iaob.org/

[Now this question is telling how well we know our customer base, and I understand that we have this weakness.]

When grappling with what to do concerning the new SI for 7.4.1.2, Supplier Quality Management System Development, and possibly making a distinction between Automotive and Non-Automotive (ISO Certification VS. TS Certification) my current management gave the impression that our registrar was not interested in our customers who primarily provide 'service parts' as opposed to 'production parts.' I was surprised with this position, so thought I would ask my fellow covers if there is any truth to this thinking. I would think that the TS scope would cover both production and service parts- right? I mean most of the CSRs for record retention of Part Approvals, Tooling Records, and Purchase Orders is "for the length of time that the part (or family of parts) is active for production and service requirements plus one calendar year."

Am I wrong?

Thanks,
Doug


Service parts clearly are within the scope of TS-16949, as Dirks's post #6 cites. Service parts are ordered and shipped to OE sites, and most of the same requirements and rules apply. Some companies have entire plants dedicated to just service parts, and they can be registered to TS.

"Aftermarket" parts are not generally sold to OE's. Sears, Pep Boys, etc. would be outside the scope of TS.

Note: There could be customers who want suppliers to follow TS rules, though they would not meet the applicability as stated in TS. I don't know of any but an example could be a tractor manufacturer could require TS systems. It would be a customer requirement the plant followed, though it would be outside the scope of my TS audit.

Note: Service provision is not the same as Service Parts. And, it is not addressing warranty replacements. Service provision would be similar to field servicing forklifts and copiers. It is rarely applicable.