I noticed that some cove users are asking the same questions again which I beleive had already discussed in the cove.
How do we address this issue here?

I noticed that some cove users are asking the same questions again which I beleive had already discussed in the cove.
How do we address this issue here?

A lot of the questions that come up again and again are logically from new members of the Cove, who does not not how to use the forum yet. Usually we guide them to the answers they need, explain how the search feature works or answer their questions in the post.

It serves no purpose to clubber someone over the head for making a slight error. Some of the newcomers are going to be productive members of the Cove, given time, and if we hassle them over petty things we may loose them. Just my :2cents:

Some of the newcomers are going to be productive members of the Cove, given time, and if we hassle them over petty things we may loose them. Just my :2cents:Exactly. :agree1: Besides, it happens that old answers are no longer valid. We need to evolve and improve, just like the rest of the world.

Oh, btw: I moved this thread to this forum. I think it belongs here.

/Claes

Good reply from Gert. If you termed those who had been around for several years and chalked up 100-200 posts as veterans, some may be guilty also (albeit unconsciously). If I am not mistaken, one was in the habit of harping over things like karma, when is the next revision of standards, validation versus verification, etc, etc. But that is his business and I am quite sure he isn't aware of it.

Under such circumstances, perhaps the moderator can amalgamate the thread with a relevant and existing one for better organization.

I admit it! If you chalked up my replies only half of them would be relevant. I like to keep the tone light - some times. And, some of my replies are simply spin offs from my mindset, i.e. humour :D Still, i presume that it is better than all of them having no relevanse.

There is a box in the New Post page, next to where one puts the title, which allows for someone to do a quick search from there on what they're going to ask. That was one thing I've tried. Many times I have put in a 'Search Link' to help someone: Putting 'Search' links within posts (http://elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?t=16803).

But the bottom line is, over the years this has been, and always will be, an issue in any forum environment. Actually this thread is redundant in that we have discussed this in many threads alreads over the years

Gert's and Claes' points are well taken.

As to Harry's "amalgamate the thread", threads can be combined. The problem is posts are all put in order by date and threads become disjointed sometimes to the extent they simply don't make sense. And, as Claes pointed out, you start mixing old and new.

On the other hand some forums delete threads after a few years or so. Some do more frequently. I don't think this forum is big enough to need to 'trim' threads, but more important is the old threads are instructive in that, when taken in context and with respect to date, they give a picture of the evolution of the interpretations of the standards.

A search is great, when you have time and know how things work, but usually we are trying to get an answer in a hurry to cover some issue we are dealing with right now. So we throw out the question and see what comes back.

Plus asking the same, or similar, questions often yield new insights and points of view.

James

I noticed that some cove users are asking the same questions again which I beleive had already discussed in the cove.
How do we address this issue here?


You know, that's a good question. I am a bit of a newbie to the Cove and to ASQ discussion board. If you think about it, it's a much different communication method. Saying, one has to learn (like everything else in life) how to properly use a discussion board, and it will come with time. I still learn things about the Cove and it's features every day.

Too, most people posting are desperate and frustrated. They are at the end of their rope, and the Cove is their last ditch effort to get information they can't get anywhere else.

...Too, most people posting are desperate and frustrated. They are at the end of their rope, and the Cove is their last ditch effort to get information they can't get anywhere else.

And as already stated, often the OP is in a hurry for the answer, with little or no time to do a thorough search....

One thing that I have noticed is the good memory of Covers. It seems no matter how unique or obscure the question, someone remembers it has been asked before and sends the person to the right thread. Sometimes it even gets the discussion started again with new thoughts as others have noted. After using this board and the one at ASQ, I have found it a useful, informative and generally accurate way to exchange quality subject matter. If I remember the history of the Internet, I think it was originally started to share information easily. Maybe we have just come full circle.

Bill Pflanz

And as already stated, often the OP is in a hurry for the answer, with little or no time to do a thorough search....

Good point - but I find more often it's being unfamiliar with this Forum and how it is set-up. I'm sure that the first few questions that I asked here had been addressed before. Once a user knows how to search and where to search - liefe get easier!

Good point - but I find more often it's being unfamiliar with this Forum and how it is set-up. I'm sure that the first few questions that I asked here had been addressed before. Once a user knows how to search and where to search - liefe get easier!


Another point might be how comfortable and astute you are at searching. What I mean is putting in the right search criteria can be tricky depending on what info you are looking for. Then you wind up sifting through a lot of irrelevent intormation.

And I don't know about you folks, but I am easily distracted....:notme:

James

I noticed that some cove users are asking the same questions again which I beleive had already discussed in the cove.
How do we address this issue here?
:thanks:

I think somebody might have already asked about questions that have been asked before. :D

I'm fairly new to "the Cove" (6 months) and am not savy on chat rooms, discussion forums or anything else to do with internet communication. I learned of this group through an iso 9001 email dis list that turned into a discussion forum. That forum then pretty much died, I feel because the idea of a discussion forum just did not sit well with the majority of the email users. To this point I have not asked any new questions or started any new threads as you call them, mainly because of the comments I've read when "newby's" goof and ask a previously asked or similar to previously posted question and the old timers jump all over them. So what - at least they are participating, isn't that what this is about?! If someone is brave enough to ask something, send them to the info they need, explain the right way if you must - but do so with a smile, don't make them feel like an idiot. It must be particularly hard for those people who do not speak English as a first language. Nuances in phraseologies probably prevent them from even realizing that they might be asking something that is already being addressed.

To this point I have not asked any new questions or started any new threads as you call them, mainly because of the comments I've read when "newby's" goof and ask a previously asked or similar to previously posted question and the old timers jump all over them. So what - at least they are participating, isn't that what this is about?! If someone is brave enough to ask something, send them to the info they need, explain the right way if you must - but do so with a smile, don't make them feel like an idiot.

I'm glad you're here, but I'm a little surprised that you refrain from posting due to fear of being belittled or otherwise mistreated. I think we do have a few people who might be a little quick on the trigger, but when you're dealing with a very large number of contributors and their widely dispersed personalities, sometimes stuff happens. It's very infrequent though and hugely disproportionate to the number of new visitors who are warmly welcomed and directed to the information they're looking for.

I agree with Jim. But the Cove is not a place of "unconditional love and understanding". If people come here expecting to have their hands hold and baby sat, they need to re-think their expectations. I believe most seasoned members will not flame or attack newbies and rookies gratuitiously, but one can answer the same basic questions so many times, without getting frustrated. Especially because, had the poster done a search, s/he would have found the answer to the question.
Maybe we should make the process of using the search features better understood by rookies, before letting them lose.

By the way, my book (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5216&d=1149560855) is already on the 7th Edition.

Maybe we should make the process of using the search features better understood by rookies, before letting them loose.
Good idea! Any suggestions for text [pictures, video, etc.] and where to put it?

By the way, my book (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5216&d=1149560855) is already on the 7th Edition.
Do I have to come all the way to "la la land" to get an autographed copy?:lmao:

....It must be particularly hard for those people who do not speak English as a first language. Nuances in phraseologies probably prevent them from even realizing that they might be asking something that is already being addressed.

Thank you, Juliana. Allow me to play both sides of the fence.

Yes, just like at work or home, people have bad days. Things are sometimes posted that maybe could have been thought out a little more. Every single person, every single day should strive to be more patient and understanding.

However.... from what I have seen-a vast majority of the "flak" comes through the simple act of not caring, not proofreading, not checking spelling, and not providing a remotely structured question with even a minute amount of details.

There is another post going as we speak where it took the individual over three tries to get done what they were trying to get done. No one ridiculed this individual; rather, offered up continued assistance.

Too, I must take issue with your statement about English-second language (ESL) posters. Yes, sometimes someone may have to ask for a re-post, as there may be some ambiguity. However, there are many hear who are ESL that write borderline perfect English. It's not about the language; it's about caring enough to type a good post.

As far as posting previous threads-when someone posts a thread where something has already been discussed, it's not a slap in the face-we've covered this already. Rather, it's-here's 40 posts on your subject. See if you can get instant help for your query. If not, then repost your question. There is a difference.

Again, thanks for taking the courage to post a possibly unpopular opinion, and venting some frustration. Please make posts whenever possible.

By the way, my book (http://elsmar.com/Forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=5216&d=1149560855) is already on the 7th Edition.

I really don't have time for the read. Does it have Cliff Notes? :notme:

To this point I have not asked any new questions or started any new threads as you call them, mainly because of the comments I've read when "newby's" goof and ask a previously asked or similar to previously posted question and the old timers jump all over them.

Yes, we tell people that a subject has been discussed, and that the search function will give them more information. For my part, I've done it myself, but usually because a question was so generic that a truly helpful answer would be impossible to give. I think for the number of posts, and the number of new registrations each month, most of the "old timers" are pretty helpful compared to a lot of boards. I am sorry that you feel intimidated from starting discussions.

I sometimes think that it is just like conversation, what is said is not as big a factor as how it is interpretted. Remember that the written word has no subtle nuances such as tone and inflection, so you have to take what is written at face value, and assume that it is meant to be helpful.

Also, most of us are "quality geeks" somewhat akin, if not full fledged, engineer types. We are logical, in a hurry to get where we are going, and somewhat handicapped in the schmooze factor. (I have a sign on my door, I open it for one hour a day for people who need to be coddled, all other time is dedicated solely to "git 'r done". )

Again, welcome and I hope that your first impression does not limit your participation.

For as many questions and comments that are in this forum, I suppose the few critical ones that I have come across are not a disproportionate number. Having read those though, I did back off asking a question because I didn't have time to do a thorough search and I didn't want someone to come back at me with "you should have gone ....."

I guess to me, redundant questions aren't a problem. I've spent the last 8 years of my life addressing them at work and if I made everyone search for their own answers first (we do have a very well documented quality managment system) I wouldn't have a job. I give them their answer if I have it and lead them to where the answers are - and usually after 2 or 3 times, they learn that looking for it themselves is easier than waiting for me to do it for them (750 users in 15 different sites). Of course this forum is not the same as work - thank heavens for that, although for some of you it must seem to be.

I did get the correct message from reading those comments though, that you don't want people to ask something if they haven't looked through everything first. If that is the case and redundant questions are truly a problem, it does somehow need to be emphasized a little bit more when people first join the cove. The "search" could be highlighted more, a big bold "light bulb" or something, and then how about a pop up that would display when you start a post, something that says: "Did you seach for an answer first?"

It is also true that I really do enjoy what I have found in the Cove, when I have time to come here! I have read many comments that were extremely helpful and tolerant. I do get some very good ideas and hints from everyone and I have tried on a few occasions to share my experiences. I find it helpful to "listen" to problems that other people are experiencing in hopes that I will learn and can prevent similar things in my own world. I must thank all of you for your time and efforts. :applause:

thanks, Juliana, for your feedback. Yes, I think you hit it on the head when you talk about "not having time". Posters are usually in a hurry because they are working on a deadline and need answers, we (regulars) often try to answer questions in a few minutes here and there throughout the day and are short on time ourselves. It is a societal problem, everything is rush, rush, rush. Anyway, without feedback, it is impossible to improve.