I need some help in interpreting a real life scenario with the ISO 9000 Quality Management System.

For a project, the Internal Audit non-conformance is open for more than 3 months.
Repeated reminders have been sent to the owner and the concerned reporting manager to take corrective actions, but there is no success.
The open NC status was flashed in the management review too; despite there was no insistence from the concerned senior members to take corrective actions.

Is this a case of Lack of Management Commitment?

Everyone knows what needs to be done, but no one is willing / initiating to do the same and the auditor on its own cannot close the NC in isolation unless the corrective actions have been implemented and verified.

If an auditor is to view this situation from third person perspective, would this go under Internal Audit Failure or Failure of management to commit itself to the Quality System?

Thanks,

I need some help in interpreting a real life scenario with the ISO 9000 Quality Management System.

For a project, the Internal Audit non-conformance is open for more than 3 months.
Repeated reminders have been sent to the owner and the concerned reporting manager to take corrective actions, but there is no success.
The open NC status was flashed in the management review too; despite there was no insistence from the concerned senior members to take corrective actions.

Is this a case of Lack of Management Commitment?

Everyone knows what needs to be done, but no one is willing / initiating to do the same and the auditor on its own cannot close the NC in isolation unless the corrective actions have been implemented and verified.

If an auditor is to view this situation from third person perspective, would this go under Internal Audit Failure or Failure of management to commit itself to the Quality System?

Thanks,

The information is - of course - a bit scarse, but as far as I can see, all that the internal auditor can do is to keep pushing for a response. This should be done both in writing and by holding meetings. Management should be informed regularly about all, if any, progress that is being made. That should make it clear that the internal auditor has tried to keep the NC alive and active. :bigwave:

I need some help in interpreting a real life scenario with the ISO 9000 Quality Management System.

For a project, the Internal Audit non-conformance is open for more than 3 months.
Repeated reminders have been sent to the owner and the concerned reporting manager to take corrective actions, but there is no success.
The open NC status was flashed in the management review too; despite there was no insistence from the concerned senior members to take corrective actions.

Is this a case of Lack of Management Commitment?

Everyone knows what needs to be done, but no one is willing / initiating to do the same and the auditor on its own cannot close the NC in isolation unless the corrective actions have been implemented and verified.

If an auditor is to view this situation from third person perspective, would this go under Internal Audit Failure or Failure of management to commit itself to the Quality System?

Thanks,

From what you have described, it sounds like a lack of Management Commitment... since the internal auditor is pushing for a corrective action and the NC has been brought to Management´s attention during the review meetings... when is your next surveillance audit? Maybe a "kick in the butt" from the CB will wake up the management !:notme:

Patkim:

Before we can diagnose the issue as a potential non-conformity view by the third party, we must be able to understand the nature of the internal audit finding. If management have not acted upon it for so long, it might be because they see no value to taking action.

It may be that these people don't know enough to debate the audit nc when it was found, preferring to 'do nothing' and wait until someone higher gets involved to have it removed. It's only worth writing an nc which (someone) in management sees the benefit of addressing.

Could you describe the content of the internal audit non-conformity for us?

We have the same issues with getting CARs completed. It's a systemic problem stemming from lack of management commitment. Production does not consider CARs important, management doesn't back up the CAR process and it's been that way for some time, in fact, so long that the QM has stopped writing CARs unless they are critical to operations or written up by the client. Point being, try and get a resolution, even if management just decides to void the item, because the road this leads down is a pain in the butt to get out of.

If an organization truely has so much commitment lacking in it's management, then there's something fundamentally wrong with the organization. Worrying about CARs and such like is only, therefore, the tip of the iceberg.

I'd suggest that - even without knowing the content of the internal audit nc, and whether it was 'worth' working on - the qms is a sham.

It may have been 'registerable', but in fact it's currently not operating to help management achieve their objectives or it's not taking care of the customer. If it were either, then (at least some) management would give a hoot about it.

You see, properly done, the qms should be doing something to control the business processes to get the results you management are measured against. So, if there's no commitment, either there's a process/product performance issue which will bite them, or they are loosing money due to under performance. Has anyone ever explained that to them?

My guess is there are many other aspects of this system that need an overhaul- management review, maybe the corrective action system isn't that effective, even if they were committed to it! Compounding the situation with poor audit findings won't help, either.

Commitment needs understanding, first. No-one will support (except lip service) something that they don't 'get' or doesn't add value. Why would they???

That's what's so much better about the ISO 9001:2000 version - it has direct benefit for management, they just don't always understand that..........