View Full Version : Classifying Nonconformance so that they can be Actioned in Relation to Time Frames
Dianna 25th February 2008, 08:23 PM We have been audited and requested to classify our nonconformances so that they can be actioned in relation to time frames. For example Level
A is critical and must be actioned straight away, Level B is major and must be actioned within 5 working days, etc. The question I have is what criteria do I put against level A , level B, etc, we are a small machining shop and the majority of nonconformances are product related.
Jim Wynne 25th February 2008, 08:42 PM We have been audited and requested to classify our nonconformances so that they can be actioned in relation to time frames. For example Level
A is critical and must be actioned straight away, Level B is major and must be actioned within 5 working days, etc. The question I have is what criteria do I put against level A , level B, etc, we are a small machining shop and the majority of nonconformances are product related.
Audited by whom? Is this a customer requirement, or was it an ISO audit? If it was the former, your customer should be able to help with the criteria. If it was an ISO CB audit, you should question the "requirement."
Howard Atkins 25th February 2008, 09:05 PM Welcome,
Normally Major is where there is a complete breakdown of a system, or a number of minors,or the possibility of rejected parts getting to the customer.
A minor is an individual lapse
I would use your own judgement
Sidney Vianna 25th February 2008, 09:24 PM Dianna, welcome to The Cove. There is no pre-set criteria for this. It looks like your organization might be AS9100 certified. If that was the case, the external audits conducted by your Certification Body must follow the categorization of Major and minor, laid down by AS9101 and AS9104.
But the categorization of your INTERNAL NC's and timeliness for resolving them is not established by any International Standard that I am aware of.
So, if someone tells you that you have to implement such criteria, you have to throw the question back at them, like Jim said. Why should you follow a criteria that it was not invented in your own backyard? You should consider fighting this back, otherwise, whomever is trying to impose this criteria onto your employer might try to micro-manage your business.
somerqc 25th February 2008, 09:27 PM I have never understood classifying nonconformances in this manner. Why? Because, everywhere I have worked we have always reviewed nonconformances and decided immediately if any additional actions beyond containment was necessary.
For instance, product rejected during process. It is identified and segregated. When I am doing "my rounds", the lead person contacts me (or I notice the segregation). The product is reviewed. There is a discussion with the lead any potentially the worker(s) involved.
If deemed necessary, I review the issue with management to decide the final steps.
There are very rare instances where management needs to be directly involved. The majority of the time any actions taken are implemented by the manager with my assistance (re: root cause analysis, fault trees, impact analysis, etc.).
Just my two cents.
John
Geoff Withnell 25th February 2008, 09:41 PM I have never understood classifying nonconformances in this manner. Why? Because, everywhere I have worked we have always reviewed nonconformances and decided immediately if any additional actions beyond containment was necessary.
For instance, product rejected during process. It is identified and segregated. When I am doing "my rounds", the lead person contacts me (or I notice the segregation). The product is reviewed. There is a discussion with the lead any potentially the worker(s) involved.
If deemed necessary, I review the issue with management to decide the final steps.
There are very rare instances where management needs to be directly involved. The majority of the time any actions taken are implemented by the manager with my assistance (re: root cause analysis, fault trees, impact analysis, etc.).
Just my two cents.
John
John,
Root cause analysis, fault trees, etc take time and effort. Resources are not unlimited. Have you never had to let the analysis of an unimportant cosmetic defect go while a larger issue was worked? Certainly any nonconformance should be handled promptly. All classification of nonconformances is intended to do is set appropriate limits, and allow everyone to readily know the priorities.
Geoff Withnell
AndyN 25th February 2008, 09:53 PM We have been audited and requested to classify our nonconformances so that they can be actioned in relation to time frames. For example Level
A is critical and must be actioned straight away, Level B is major and must be actioned within 5 working days, etc. The question I have is what criteria do I put against level A , level B, etc, we are a small machining shop and the majority of nonconformances are product related.
Dianna - great advice here. Really the critical issue of setting timeframes for action is the content and nature of the finding. Grading them 'A' or 'B', 'Major' or 'Minor' etc is of little value if the details in the NC don't support them. My advice - based on over 20 years of audit experience - don't grade them, write good NCs which justify getting management's support to fix them.
somerqc 25th February 2008, 10:19 PM Geoff,
That is where some "common sense" is required to determine the "critical" status. I have been given the authority to complete the majority of these assessments "on the fly".
95% of these "root cause analysis" take about 10-15 minutes while on the floor. No formal meeting is required. Just the "stakeholders" of the process. It is my job to know whether a change in one process will affect another.
It is very rare that a 3 hour meeting is required to determine the root cause and determine an effective corrective action.
Again - just my experience and two cents
John
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