Hello everybody,
I have a basic question about these two term; Supplier and Subcontractor,
What are differents between these two word and their concepts?

Subcontractors are defined a providers of production materials, or production or service parts, directly to a supplier to Chrysler, Ford, General Motors or other customers subscribing to this document. Also included are providers of heat treating, painting, plating or other finishing services.

Suppliers are defined as providers of a) production materials, b) production or service parts, or c) heat treating, plating, painting or other finishing services directly to Chrysler, Ford, General Motors or other customers subscribing to this document.

Does this answer your question?

Angela:)

Angela
Could you explain the difference in your definitions. I just don't see it.

Just a note
Ts 16949 - Clause 3 - Terms and Definitions - "Also, the term "supplier" now replaces the term "subcontractor". "

Without getting into a semantics debate, use of the term supplier makes more sense than subcontractor - at least for our business. Even if we "subcontract", the part (or service) is still "supplied" to us.

I'm starting to get dizzy. I'm sorry I can't present my thoughts better right now, but maybe my gibberish will click something in someone else's head.

Bill

Okay. My definitions came from the QS-9000 Third Edition Quality System Requirement manual. What are you looking for? ISO9000:2000, TS or QS?

Angela

Thank u all,
But I haven't recieved my answer yet. I want to know the reason of replacing "Subcontractor" with "Supplier" by ISO.
I think your answers aren't good reason for them.

rgds Quality Researcher

Why replace subcontractor by supplier.

In ISO 9000:1994 the company/organization that produces the goods is called supplier. The company/organization supplies goods to the customer. And the one who supplies materiails to the company/organization is called subcontractor or sub-supplier.

So the supply chain looks like this:

Subcontractor/sub-supplier----->Supplier----->Customer

In ISO 9000:2000 the words are changed as they use in the ordinary definition or the definition in the dictionary.

So the supply chain looks like this:

Supplier----->Company/organization----->Customer.




:biglaugh: :biglaugh:

Under the QS definitions:

Supplier = organization implementing QS-9000 and producing product.

Subcontractor = companies the supplier buys stuff from.

Customer = company the supplier sells to.

It does not matter where in the supply chain you are - if you are the one implementing QS, you are the supplier.

ISO 9001: 2000 and TS-16949: 2000 changed supplier to organization and subcontractor to supplier. I think the main reason was that the use of supplier and subcontractor is confusing, since they are synonyms in a normal dictionary. Organization is now the company implementing the standard, supplier is the company they buy from. Customer remains the same.

In one of my first ISO meetings many years ago we spent about 3 hours debating which term to use in our purchasing procedure: supplier, subcontractor or vendor. Could not convince management it did not matter - pick one and stick with it.

Tom

Tom - with all respect, those are not the definitions given in my QS-9000 Third Edition.

Subcontractor - Subcontractors are defined as providers of production materials, or production or service parts, directly to a supplier to C, F GM or other customers subscribing to this [QS] document.

Supplier - Suppliers are defined as providers of: a0 production materials, b) production or service parts, or c) heat treating, plating, painting or other finishing services, directly (underline is theirs, not mine) to C, F GM or other customers subscribing to this [QS] document.

Dave

Dave,

Correct - those are my interpretations of the definitions in QS. In another thread (C9 interpretation) we were dissecting the definitions trying to figure out if supplier meant only tier-1, as implied in Jim's post. My point was that a supplier is not only someone who supplies to Ford, GM or DC. Any company that sells to a customer requiring QS is a supplier.

Example: If you make parts only for Lear. Lear uses your parts in an assembly sold to Ford. You are a tier-2 to Ford. Lear requires you to be QS-9000. Lear is the "customer subscribing to QS". You are the supplier. Those companies you buy parts and services from are subcontractors.

If you look at it from the standpoint of the rest of the standard, the phrase “the supplier shall” is used many, many times. If you made the claim that you are not a supplier because you are tier-2 to the B3, there is no way you could be certified because the standard is directed to the supplier, not “the subcontractor shall”.


Tom