Just out of curiosity, who feels that they are compliant to the new requirements for subcontractor development? If you feel you are not complaint, then why?

Angela

We are not compliant because we have not got a waiver from our customers for conducting second party audits on behalf of customer. For your information we are Tier 1 to some customers. or Tier 2 suppliers to some customers

You do realize that you only need authorization from your customer who prescribe to QS?

Angela

Are there NEW subcontractor development requirements. What were the old ones. Where can I find this back?

We are a Tier 2 supplier.

Do we need our vendors/subcontractors to be QS or TS certified. For metrology do we need to have metrology houses to be IS 17025 certified, or is this all optional?

S.

Have you got a copy of the C9 interpretation? If not you can print it off at www.qs-9000.org.

Angela

After discussing the situation with Russ Hopkins and Bob Klien, we came to an understanding about directed suppliers. We are now in compliance in the production area.
Now, add in the new Ford Minority Supplier requirements and we go back to square 1.:bonk:

We are currently about 98 % there. Sounds good but it actually maeans 95% were already registered 3% have been pushed in because of the interpretation and 2% still have no plans to comply, ever.

As you can see I am down to the impossible part with AH !!! maybe a way out. :D

Q1. If I am QS and my customer is ISO can I use a subcontractor that is niether.
>> Common sense tells me I can since my customer does not care and certainly is not interested in doing an assesment.
>> on the other hand am I obligated to meet the requirement because I am QS.

Q2. Has anyone been through and audit with this one and come out alive at the other end!!!!

:confused: why did they throw this one in.

P.S

What is this about a waiver? AH!! Is this yet another way out. Please explain if you have presented this in an audit with success. What did you present as a waiver?


Yes, I am getting desperate (between a rock and a hard place, so they say). Please help me out if you can.

Thanks so much for being in the same boat.

P.S

What is this about a waiver? AH!! Is this yet another way out. Please explain if you have presented this in an audit with success. What did you present as a waiver?


Yes, I am getting desperate (between a rock and a hard place, so they say). Please help me out if you can.

Thanks so much for being in the same boat.

A waiver from your customer is acceptable. The biggest problem will be getting your customer to actually sign it. I believe any format would be acceptable - just make sure it is clear who authorized it at your customer.

There is guidance for the registrar on how to handle a finding of a non-certified subcontractor (without a waiver). The info is in other threads here and at www.iaob.org.

Basically it would be a minor nonconformance. If you are having quality problems at the customer (i.e. containment) it becomes a major. Interesting thing is that the non-certfied supplier and quality problem at the customer can be completly unrelated, but it still is supposed to be a major.

I think much will come down to your auditor and registrar. If it is a minor supplier and not causing problems, most auditors I have worked with will look the other way. A few will write up anything they can find.

Tom

I just finished my recertification audit. Came through with flying colors. Only 3 minor nonconformances. Subcontractor development went great. Now I can confirm that you only need worry about it if you are a tier 1 supplier. If any has questions let me know.

Angela

Angela

Glad to hear all went well.

Are you sugesting that if I am not Tier 1 to big 3 them I am not required to conform to C9. I was told that if I am QS them I must. Can you point out for me where in the standard it implies this. QUOTE "No matter who your customer is or what they require, you must comply with all QS Requirements"

Also I checked with my registrar and they will not accept waivers. As per Appendix I, #3. because 4.6.2.1 is not shown. I disagree. The examples are exactly that, exambles. NOT a list of what can be waived.

They will also not allow Appendix I #4 to be used to exclude suppliers.

During my audit yesterday I asked my auditors if they had seen many problems with the new requirement. They told me that they had not seen many problems due to it only being a tier one requirement. I don't understand how your registrar can tell you that you cannot use Appendix I.4. You need to get tough with them. They work for you.

Angela

SMcD,

I would be very careful with the "tier-1 only" requirement. The wording of the guidance documents (www.qs-9000.org) states "subcontractors of suppliers that have QS-9000". I have heard from several registrars that the requirements apply to all QS certified companies. If you are going to try to use this I would get it in writing from your registrar - try to get in touch with their technical manager (or equivalent) that sets interpretations and policies. Every registrar (and auditor) may have their own opinion.

Your customer should be able to waive this requirement. The guidance at www.qs-9000.org gives specific examples.

Tom

Your customer should be able to waive this requirement

Tom, where is the provision for waive. I have heard that this is being done, but I cannot find any provision for it. It is allowed in TS, but I can't find it in QS. :confused:

DB,

If you go to www.qs-9000.org and select the Additional Information link it has a Q&A about C9. I misread it as saying a customer waiver is acceptable. It actually states the SUPPLIER may waive elements of QS-9000 (same as Appendix I #4). I suppose you could try to waive all 20 elements if necessary.

I have always been under the impression that a customer could waive any requirement of QS, but Appendix I #3 reads as only when permitted by QS. I have not had waivers come up often, but I know I have used them in situations not specifically allowed by QS.

Tom

Related threads:

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=451

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=472

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4813

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=478

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4813

Related Poll:

http://Elsmar.com/Forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4694