I'm looking for ideas to handle customer specification changes.
"... have a process to assure the timely review, distriubtion and implementation of all customer engineering standards/specifications and changes based on customer required schedule".
Its the customer required schedule thats throughing us. In a previous life we were just notified of the specification change and then had to find the standard, what changed and how that impacted our operation. I'm not sure that this is what will be allowed here. :bonk:

Another question that came up is how to track the applicability of the standards to each part produced? Ideas please. :bigwave:

I'm looking for ideas to handle customer specification changes.
"... have a process to assure the timely review, distriubtion and implementation of all customer engineering standards/specifications and changes based on customer required schedule".
Its the customer required schedule thats throughing us. In a previous life we were just notified of the specification change and then had to find the standard, what changed and how that impacted our operation. I'm not sure that this is what will be allowed here. :bonk:

Another question that came up is how to track the applicability of the standards to each part produced? Ideas please. :bigwave:When we send changes to our suppliers, we expect the following:

acknowledge receiving change notice
tell us how it may affect schedule, work in process, goods in inventory, price, etc.
call us if anything about change is not clear
if it involves change in design, tell us you have collected all obsolete designs (ours and/or your shop drawings) and sequestered them to avoid making new product to old design
keep us up-to-date if any glitches arise
This is whether supplier is registered or compliant to ANY Standard.

I believe the "customer required schedule" is focused on making sure that implementation occurs by the date they require. The specification review must occur within two working weeks.

Can you give an example of the kinds of specifications you are talking about? Do you mean things like packaging specifications that apply to multiple parts?

What is the kinds of Engineering Specifications? can you give an example?

What is the kinds of Engineering Specifications? can you give an example?

I'm looking at things like e-coat or a-coat or fastener standards. These will affect many products.

Also what do I need to do to track the parts affected by the change?

I'm looking at things like e-coat or a-coat or fastener standards. These will affect many products.

Also what do I need to do to track the parts affected by the change?

What we use is the work order number and the serial ID for tracking changes.

I'd like to know what others are using to ensure that customer engineering specifications and standards are being reviewed for changes as the current systems do not notify us to changes, as well there are hundreds that apply to us. For example the online Daimlerchrysler standards. Someone needs to be constantly monitoring these, determining if a change will trigger a change to our product or process, all within a two week change period.

Cheers,

Jen

I suggest that the best way to handle ANY such changes are to run them through your Contract Review and, if accepted, the ECN (engineering change) system. That should include provisions to address any issues (such as use up stock or scrap stock).

My policy has been if you change your requirements, I have to run it through our engineering change system. Until I do that I don't know if I can even give you what you're asking for. And just as important, what will the change cost or save?

Many times a change in customer requirements is something minor. But I've also seen complanies say "Sure, we can do that" only to find that the cost is prohibitive. Sometimes a whole new quotation is necessary.

My problem is not how to handle changes but how to find out about them. There is no subscription service and I'm left with the task of assigning my Product Engineers with reviewing all their applicable customer engineering specifications on a weekly basis. I don't know about your company but my engineers will do this once or twice and never again.

What are other people doing to ensure changes that are not communicated by the customer?

My problem is not how to handle changes but how to find out about them. There is no subscription service and I'm left with the task of assigning my Product Engineers with reviewing all their applicable customer engineering specifications on a weekly basis. I don't know about your company but my engineers will do this once or twice and never again.

What are other people doing to ensure changes that are not communicated by the customer?

Where is the requirement that states that I should look for changes that are not communcated by the customer?
This act may be possible in the eyes of a few misguided auditors, but it is surely not cost effective and I'm quite sure the customer would not want to pay for the increased cost.
IMO the reference to change in 4.2.3.1 refers to changes communicated by the customer only!

"4.2.3.1 Engineering specifications
The organization shall have a process to assure the timely review, distribution and implementation of all customer
engineering standards/specifications and changes based on customer-required schedule. Timely review should be
as soon as possible, and shall not exceed two working weeks."

I don't think it's possible to misintrepret this. The above lumps engineering standards/specifications and changes together as needing timely review and then further defines timely review as not exceeding two working weeks.

Therefore I still have an issue. Any ideas?

Jen

:biglaugh:
Thank you all. This thread was very helpful to my engineering group as they sorted through what was "my opinion" and the facts as presented.

Especially since it so closely matched with our CB's "opinion".

Our group has a continuing struggle with the timely review but I now we have determined another gap we need to close in connect with this. We are not like Chrysler and do not have an online system which generates our Change Notices to our Vendors (in the past not been a problem). We have in the past used our Purchased drawings and sent them to our Vendors requesting them to sign off but are now being asked for more details than just the drawings.

We are now expanding our business which has given us more Vendors to work with and as most company's have experience now some are overseas.

We have a very good ECR process inhouse and have an access database for tracking which we can modify to track CN's to Vendors but can anyone share how they notify their Vendors of CN's and maybe some actual examples of documents they use?

We are TS16949 certified and I know that this is a gap that needs to be closed soon. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I'm looking for ideas to handle customer specification changes.
"... have a process to assure the timely review, distriubtion and implementation of all customer engineering standards/specifications and changes based on customer required schedule".
Its the customer required schedule thats throughing us. In a previous life we were just notified of the specification change and then had to find the standard, what changed and how that impacted our operation. I'm not sure that this is what will be allowed here. :bonk:

Another question that came up is how to track the applicability of the standards to each part produced? Ideas please. :bigwave:

I think you can treat customer specification change as engineering change.

If your customer wants your following one standard, and you think it is not quite suitable, you can discuss with them or get some suggestion from authority dept or persons.

My problem is not how to handle changes but how to find out about them. There is no subscription service and I'm left with the task of assigning my Product Engineers with reviewing all their applicable customer engineering specifications on a weekly basis. I don't know about your company but my engineers will do this once or twice and never again.

What are other people doing to ensure changes that are not communicated by the customer?


Our customer representative checks purchase orders, as they arrive, against the current rev. that's in our database. If they don't match and there was no engineering change order given us by the customer, we contact them and let them know. Until it's resolved, we won't run the parts unless we have a written deviation from the customer.

Hello There,

We have written a procedure stating that we only handle standards change analysis during the product development/change stage or if the customer asks for it.

We will never engage in reviewing all the standard updated from all our customers all year round for all the products we manufacture since it would imply hiring tens of people and nagging our customers sending them unasked-for quotations.:bonk:

That's my two cents

François

To everyone,:)
I just want to clarify on Engineering Specifications.
In my understanding Engineering Specifications are the specific requirements that the product is expected to meet. Speaking of requirements, these are limits, e.g. test limit ranges from –5Vdc to +5Vdc. Our procedure states that “If there is no specified customer review schedule, a timely review should be as soon as possible and shall not exceed two (2) working weeks.”
In this regard, I have a concern on the review of engineering specifications: “ Test programs that are being sent to us and the only requirement by our customer is to acknowledge that we received the test programs.”
In this regard, are we satisfying the requirements of Clause 4.2.3.1 Review of Engineering Specifications? Please advice.
1. If yes, can we have a provision that these test programs are not part of the engineering specifications? :confused:
2. If no, it takes time (greater than 2 working weeks) for an engineer to validate the test program that are being sent by the customer.
3. Are we violating the requirements of Clause 4.2.3.1 Review of Engineering Specifications? :(
Thank you very much in advance for the usual kind attention you will give this request.
Best regards,
Raffy:cool:

Hi There,

I'm looking for a procedure or documentation to handle Customer Engineering as we have just started engineering department in our medical device comapny & we dont have any written procedure for the same. Could anyone help me in this regard.

Thank you in advance for your kind help

Regards,
Deepa

To everyone,:)
I just want to clarify on Engineering Specifications.
In my understanding Engineering Specifications are the specific requirements that the product is expected to meet. Speaking of requirements, these are limits, e.g. test limit ranges from –5Vdc to +5Vdc. Our procedure states that “If there is no specified customer review schedule, a timely review should be as soon as possible and shall not exceed two (2) working weeks.”
In this regard, I have a concern on the review of engineering specifications: “ Test programs that are being sent to us and the only requirement by our customer is to acknowledge that we received the test programs.”
In this regard, are we satisfying the requirements of Clause 4.2.3.1 Review of Engineering Specifications? Please advice.
1. If yes, can we have a provision that these test programs are not part of the engineering specifications? :confused:
2. If no, it takes time (greater than 2 working weeks) for an engineer to validate the test program that are being sent by the customer.
3. Are we violating the requirements of Clause 4.2.3.1 Review of Engineering Specifications? :(
Thank you very much in advance for the usual kind attention you will give this request.
Best regards,
Raffy:cool:

Hi Raffy,
4.2.3.1 states "Timely review asap . . . and shall not exceed two weeks". It does not say who, what, where or how to review. I make the initial review during preparation of the DVP&R. Thereafter I am only concerned with reviewing documents for revision change only. I find that preparing the DVP&R from the customer requirements is the most time consuming. In most cases the customer requirements are wrong, in that the test requirement paragraph(s) that they cite do not match the latest version of the test specification. It usually takes 1 to 5 days to complete the DVP&R. It can take from 1 to 6 weeks to get approval.

Hi Sam,
Thank you.
I agree with you with the requirements of 4.2.3.1 however, in our case what I did to the requirements of 4.2.3.1 is that we create a provision in which the test programs that are being sent to us by the customers and these are backup by our customer that this a normal process from their IT to send all new test program/revised test program to their subcon to ensure that all of them have a common and updated copy of test programs. As their subcon, what they require is to acknowledge the email that they received the program.
Raffy