hi guys.

In our company (palm oil production) we are trying all (ALL) employees work under the established QMS. We are not trying just the productive process and the normal support and strategic process interact in our QMS.

So, we've defined ALL process in our organization like: purchasing, sales, production, estrategic planning, accounting, ocupattional health, social work, qms, laboratory, maintenance, systems, customer care.

Then I have a little problem. Some employes came to me and they asked me: "where am I involved". The point is that Im not sure where are they located. They are: secretaries, messenger boy, clean ladies, etc.

So, it seems we forgot define another process? or its not necessary these people be involved inside QMS?

Hola . . .

You may want to re-think the strategy.

If the employees are a part of a QMS process, they are included. I think that, IMHO, you may want to look at WHY the processes you have defined are a part of the QMS, and WHAT do they DO to contribute to Quality.

Accounting, at least here in the US answers to a higher authority, and is not typically included as requiring control in the QMS.

Do the secretaries perform a function in the Document Control or Record Control processes? If so, they are a part of a QMS process. If they do not, maybe you should take advantage of some enthusiasm and train some new Internal Auditors. Let them be part of the fun.

Of course, the janitors are a very important part of any company. Without their contributions, we would all be scurrying around at times looking for a bush or piece of paper towel. Not too sure they need to be included unless they contribute to the requirements of Section 6 for Resource Management.

Hope this helped a bit. . .

well. this helps a lot, but IMHO, a QMS must be used just not for "quality" as a word that you use to define customers, as specifications.

In our organization we believe that QMS must be used to ALL activities. In others words we are trying to follow 9004 Standard in some cases.

Carlos,

I understand your position, and it sounds like you are addressing internal as well as external customers and address Total Quality.

Good luck. . .

Hi Carlos:

Perhaps, secretaries are support and communications staff, messengers are communications and maybe delivery of product and cleaning staff maintains your infrastructure. Just some thoughts,

Carlos,

All of these people Secretaries, Receptionist, Cleaners etc come under the management of our Adminsitration Manager (Office Manager) and as such are listed in his department. Could this work in you company?
List them under the manager that they work for as usually each 'process' has a manager in charge and they will be the one responible for the personnel under them and their job descriptions etc
We group our Administrationdepartment in an ancilliary role to the overall PRODUCT process departments. This includes all of those departments that do not have a direct affect on the product but the company could not operate without them. Hope this is clear.

Greg B

hi guys.

Some employes came to me and they asked me: "where am I involved". The point is that Im not sure where are they located. They are: secretaries, messenger boy, clean ladies, etc.

So, it seems we forgot define another process? or its not necessary these people be involved inside QMS?

What tasks do these people perform that is covered by the QMS?

For example, cleaning people I would think are involved in 6.3 and 6.4 for sure, perhaps others like 7.5.5 depending on what they do.

A Messenger may be involved in 5.5.3, and/or maybe 6.3c, 7.2.3.

Secretaries may help with 4.2, 5.5.3, 6.2, 7.2.3, 7.4, 7.6 (calibration records?), 8.4, perhaps others.

Hope this helps.