We have included our process audit in the system audit--internal audit, and our product audit in control plan. But we are told we cannot do like that. We must do it as required in VDA6.3 &6.5.
Hope to get help from viewers here.

Mr.Yasunari Kuo,

I am not able to attach the file on this forum for illustration. Give your mail ID I shall post it to you.
Regarding product and Process audit certainly it is different from System Audit and Control Plan. However Control plan Must be used as Check list while doing Process and Product Audit.

manojmathur@adityabirla.com

:topic: If you tried to attach a file and could not - let me know why not - what happened - and maybe I can fix whatever the problem is.

Also - Just as an FYI - Please remember if you put your e-mail address in a post 'spam bots' can 'harvest' it. It's your decision but people can e-mail you through the forums and you can use the PM (Personal Message) system in the forums software to trade e-mail addresses.

Also - Just as an FYI - Please remember if you put your e-mail address in a post 'spam bots' can 'harvest' it. It's your decision but people can e-mail you through the forums and you can use the PM (Personal Message) system in the forums software to trade e-mail addresses.In regard to harvesting of emails:
I've seen a trend where folks type in an email address as
JohnDoe(at)JohnDoe.com
[using (at) as opposed to using the @ sign.]
Does this deter the bots from gleaning/harvesting the data?
If so, perhaps we can offer it as a suggestion to our members.

I've seen that and even spelling out the 'dot'.

Can 'spam bots' get by that? I don't believe it would be that hard for the script to evaluate for those aspects but I really don't know what harvesting software is available. Take, for example, registering. People have to look at a graphic randomly generated and enter what they see for the registration to work. The spam industry is already looking at ways to 'crack' that aspect of getting past 'GD' verification.

Some simple GD graphics can be evaluated now, as I think I read a month or so back. It's a continuing battle and as processor speeds increase subroutines like pattern recognition are easier and faster. That's why all the lines and dots and fuzziness of the GD graphic (see attached) - to make pattern recognition harder.

It's not a big deal to me personally if someone wants to put in their e-mail address - I just want to make sure people know that short of closing the forums to only registered users there is no way to keep them out. That's why I keep the software set to only send 'blind' e-mails when someone wants to email a forum member. Then, if that member wants to reveal his or her e-mail address, they can.

The TS16949 requires Systems, Process and Product Audits. You may combine them or do them separately. Generally Process and Systems audits are done together while Produc audits are done separately.

The key is to differenciate the audits reports.
Systems....Show the Process approach to audit the QMS .
Process.....Show the audit of process,example the process parameters, equipment condictions, PM and etc.
Product.....Show the audit of Products, example measurement of products, test of products to assure that it meets customer or marketing drawing requirements.

Hope this helps.

i am sathish kumar pl post the process audit check list and any info on this

REGARDS

R.L.SATTHISH KUMAR