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Non-Conformance Report for Concession
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Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
Non-Conformance Report for Concession
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concessions, nonconformance report (ncr), supplier nonconformances
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  Post Number #9  
Old 10th January 2018, 04:29 AM
Ian_Morris

 
 
Total Posts: 32
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

What an interesting discussion.

For my 0.02 it really depends on the reason that the concession is required and whether it was in your control or not.

Using the examples from Golfman, if you are using a material because your stock management was the cause, there is clearly a non-conformance in the process and that should be recorded and addressed, however if the issue is outside of your control, i.e. it is due to an urgent client requirement that does not allow for the ordering profile it would not be. Where a machine will not make the part, then there is a clear non-conformance as either the process is not stable enough to produce the part and this should have been identified in the planning phase, or there is a defect with the machine that could indicate a problem with preventive maintenance schedules.

Clearly every case is different based on the merits of the circumstance, but that is why we have continuous improvement and corrective action processes to reduce variation and improve performance.

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  Post Number #10  
Old 10th January 2018, 09:19 PM
MarcM

 
 
Total Posts: 8
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Ian_Morris View Post

What an interesting discussion.

For my 0.02 it really depends on the reason that the concession is required and whether it was in your control or not.

Using the examples from Golfman, if you are using a material because your stock management was the cause, there is clearly a non-conformance in the process and that should be recorded and addressed, however if the issue is outside of your control, i.e. it is due to an urgent client requirement that does not allow for the ordering profile it would not be. Where a machine will not make the part, then there is a clear non-conformance as either the process is not stable enough to produce the part and this should have been identified in the planning phase, or there is a defect with the machine that could indicate a problem with preventive maintenance schedules.

Clearly every case is different based on the merits of the circumstance, but that is why we have continuous improvement and corrective action processes to reduce variation and improve performance.
Good point. It really does vary depending on situation.

Lets say it was decided not to write a Non-Conforming Report for the parts on Concession.
Parts are then stored in stock next to other conforming parts of same part number.
Parts are sent to production and during assembly/inspection it is noticed that these parts are "different" and as such scrutinized where it is determined that the parts are not conforming to print.
The part may then be put on a Non-Conforming Report, unless there is a process to look up that lot# in a Concession database and see if it came under a Concession. Otherwise you would need a method to identify Concession parts from good parts.

Now, if the parts on Concession were put on a Non-Conforming Report during receiving inspection, then that lot# would not be rejected again for same issue in production.

So question here is: should parts on Concession be put on a Non-Conforming Report regardless?
  Post Number #11  
Old 10th January 2018, 10:54 PM
Golfman25

 
 
Total Posts: 1,404
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by MarcM View Post

Good point. It really does vary depending on situation.

Lets say it was decided not to write a Non-Conforming Report for the parts on Concession.
Parts are then stored in stock next to other conforming parts of same part number.
Parts are sent to production and during assembly/inspection it is noticed that these parts are "different" and as such scrutinized where it is determined that the parts are not conforming to print.
The part may then be put on a Non-Conforming Report, unless there is a process to look up that lot# in a Concession database and see if it came under a Concession. Otherwise you would need a method to identify Concession parts from good parts.

Now, if the parts on Concession were put on a Non-Conforming Report during receiving inspection, then that lot# would not be rejected again for same issue in production.

So question here is: should parts on Concession be put on a Non-Conforming Report regardless?
I think it's always good practice to identify parts subject to concession. Normally in our biz there is a quantity or time limit. We would also not have conforming and concession parts at the same time. The conforming parts would have been shipped.

Bottom line, you can do what works best for you.
  Post Number #12  
Old 11th January 2018, 04:00 PM
Sidney Vianna's Avatar
Sidney Vianna

 
 
Total Posts: 9,340
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by MarcM View Post

Lets say it was decided not to write a Non-Conforming Report for the parts on Concession.
It might not be relevant for you, but, should that questionable decision be taken, it would violate not only explicit requirements of ISO 9001, but also, be counterintuitive to the "risk based thinking" thingy....

I find the resistance to record nonconforming products hard to understand, unless, as I said earlier, there is a hidden agenda. The idea of commingling conforming and nonconforming parts, next to each other, is extremely imprudent, in my estimation, and it goes against some of the most basic notions of quality management.

Progressive, forward-thinking organizations are not afraid of identifying mistakes because, this is part of learning.
Thanks to Sidney Vianna for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  Post Number #13  
Old 11th January 2018, 05:45 PM
Al Rosen's Avatar
Al Rosen

 
 
Total Posts: 3,664
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Marc:

8.7.1 The organization shall ensure that outputs that do not conform to their requirements are identified and controlled to prevent their unintended use or delivery.
Thanks to Al Rosen for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  Post Number #14  
Old 11th January 2018, 11:31 PM
MarcM

 
 
Total Posts: 8
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Golfman25 View Post

I think it's always good practice to identify parts subject to concession. Normally in our biz there is a quantity or time limit. We would also not have conforming and concession parts at the same time. The conforming parts would have been shipped.

Bottom line, you can do what works best for you.
Agree on not having conforming and concession parts in house at the same time but to demand and how parts are ordered, I've seen this occur and its a nightmare to sort through.
  Post Number #15  
Old 11th January 2018, 11:34 PM
MarcM

 
 
Total Posts: 8
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Sidney Vianna View Post

It might not be relevant for you, but, should that questionable decision be taken, it would violate not only explicit requirements of ISO 9001, but also, be counterintuitive to the "risk based thinking" thingy....

I find the resistance to record nonconforming products hard to understand, unless, as I said earlier, there is a hidden agenda. The idea of commingling conforming and nonconforming parts, next to each other, is extremely imprudent, in my estimation, and it goes against some of the most basic notions of quality management.

Progressive, forward-thinking organizations are not afraid of identifying mistakes because, this is part of learning.
Those are very good points and I completely agree with you on all those.
No hidden agenda, just a thought that was entertained.
Thanks to MarcM for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  Post Number #16  
Old 11th January 2018, 11:35 PM
MarcM

 
 
Total Posts: 8
Re: Non-Conformance Report for Concession

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Al Rosen View Post

Marc:

8.7.1 The organization shall ensure that outputs that do not conform to their requirements are identified and controlled to prevent their unintended use or delivery.
I think that basically sums it up.
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