How do you think of this EMS (environmental management system) scope?

[darkafar]

Our EMS’s scope statement is “Apply to all activities within the company.”

ISO clause 4.1 states “The organization shall define and document the scope of its environmental management system.”

I understand “environmental aspect” is defined as “element of an organization’s activities or products or services that can interact with the environment.”

I know the EMS is to control the environmental aspects, but I think the products or services are all influenced by activities.

The auditors reviewed my scope statement. Although they did not raise an issue, I can see they were not very happy about it.

How do you think of my EMS scope statement?

[Gert Sorensen]

In Reply to Parent Post by darkafar

Our EMS’s scope statement is “Apply to all activities within the company.”

Now, I don't know diddly about EMS, so this is just a thought. I think it is to vague. When you state "all activities" then you don't have anything to manage by. How are you going to handle for instance purchasing of ball point pens, paper clips, computers etc. I think you need to define the areas that you want to manage, perhaps waste disposal, detergents, emissions and so on. I also think that you need target values.

[darkafar]

In Reply to Parent Post by Gert Sorensen

Now, I don't know diddly about EMS, so this is just a thought. I think it is to vague. When you state "all activities" then you don't have anything to manage by. How are you going to handle for instance purchasing of ball point pens, paper clips, computers etc. I think you need to define the areas that you want to manage, perhaps waste disposal, detergents, emissions and so on. I also think that you need target values.

I agree it is a little vague, but consider this statement of the standard:

ISO14001 A.1 states, “Defining the scope is intended to clarify the boundaries of the organization to which the environmental management system will apply …When setting the scope, it should be noted that the credibility of the environmental management system will depend upon the choice of the organizational boundaries. If a part of an organization is excluded from the scope of its environmental management system, the organization should be able to explain the exclusion.”

However, if the scope is specific, I wonder if the auditor is going to ask why XXX is not included in the system.

You mentioned things like purchasing ball pen, waste disposal … etc. Wouldn’t it be better to describe them in objective statements?

[Gert Sorensen]

In Reply to Parent Post by darkafar

I agree it is a little vague, but consider this statement of the standard:

ISO14001 A.1 states, “Defining the scope is intended to clarify the boundaries of the organization to which the environmental management system will apply …When setting the scope, it should be noted that the credibility of the environmental management system will depend upon the choice of the organizational boundaries. If a part of an organization is excluded from the scope of its environmental management system, the organization should be able to explain the exclusion.”

However, if the scope is specific, I wonder if the auditor is going to ask why XXX is not included in the system.

You mentioned things like purchasing ball pen, waste disposal … etc. Wouldn’t it be better to describe them in objective statements?

Yes, well, hmmm. As ISO standards go that is actually pretty clear

Personally I would grasp the "it should be noted that the credibility of the environmental management system will depend upon the choice of the organizational boundaries" statement and run with it. I would define, in the policy, the extent of the scope to ensure focus and measurability, and I would write that this was done to make sure, that the policy was easy to implement, communicate and measure the effects of the policy. I might even add that the policy was to be a generic document, and that the scope was intended to be enlarged as the focus points were being implemented and the effects of the implementation was verified. Just my

[Colin]

How can I tell what your activities are if you don't tell me? I understand your concern not to get too detailed but I would think it advantageous to outline what activities you are involved in e.g. manufacture and installation of water pumping stations. That way, it should be easier to identify which regulatory requirements are applicable to you.

[Randy]

In Reply to Parent Post by darkafar

Our EMS’s scope statement is “Apply to all activities within the company.”

ISO clause 4.1 states “The organization shall define and document the scope of its environmental management system.”

I understand “environmental aspect” is defined as “element of an organization’s activities or products or services that can interact with the environment.”

I know the EMS is to control the environmental aspects, but I think the products or services are all influenced by activities.

The auditors reviewed my scope statement. Although they did not raise an issue, I can see they were not very happy about it.

How do you think of my EMS scope statement?

Your auditors were not happy because your scope statement is weak and indicates a "get-it-out-of-the-way" attitude which most likely will be reflected in your system and its performance.

Your products and services (remember products and services are interchangable words) are influenced by the those things you have placed upon you by customers, clients, regualtory and other requirements. The goal of your EMS is not to control aspects (some are or may be out of your control), but to improve upon your environmental performance.

[Holster]

I agree with others that your scope is too vague. We addressed our scope in more than one area: (1) In our EMS Manual we stated our physical address(es), a brief background of our facility, how our organization is operated, and that the scope of the EMS covers which address(es) and its purpose; (2) every procedure and work instruction also states the scope that it covers (i.e. This work instruction applies to all yadda yadda yadda).

Hope that helps you some.

--Holster

[fireonce]

IMHO,the auditor is right,the activities of your company don't include products and services.