TS 16949 Clause 8.2.2.3 - Product Audit Frequency

TS 16949 and product audit frequency

TS 16949 states in 8.2.2.3 The organization shall audit rpoducts at appropriate stages of production and delivery to all specified requirements, such as product dimensions, functionality and labeling at a defiend frequency.
Porduction does set up approval and in-process inspection, shipping final on some if not most product. Quality does audits on all these inspections including dock audits. However, the frequency depends on several factors: customer complaints or returns, new operators, frequent internal failures and lastly work load.
I am wondering if the defined frequency means I have to state three a month or daily. Does anybody know?

I would specify minimum frequencies on the control plan. Then if I do one earlier there's no problem. For dimensions and other requirements not normally audited regularly, I would set the frequency to whatever frequency I'm required to submit PPAPs for the parts. The dimensional layout, material tests, etc. then serve as the product audit.

lday38 said:

TS 16949 states in 8.2.2.3 The organization shall audit rpoducts at appropriate stages of production and delivery to all specified requirements, such as product dimensions, functionality and labeling at a defiend frequency.
Porduction does set up approval and in-process inspection, shipping final on some if not most product. Quality does audits on all these inspections including dock audits. However, the frequency depends on several factors: customer complaints or returns, new operators, frequent internal failures and lastly work load.
I am wondering if the defined frequency means I have to state three a month or daily. Does anybody know?

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Iday38,
All I did was change the name of our "In-Process and Final Inspection" to "Product Audit". I retained the same frequency and sample size.

Product audit is addional requirments on the in-process inspection/final inspection. it was used to find the deviations from customer requriements(drawings/specifications).
For the frequency, you'd better firstly ask your customer's requirements. If not have, should consider product' life cycle time.
Howste is right. do not forget to define the frequency on your control plan.

we have 2 times itineracy inspection per day (accorinding to COP and Control plan) and dock audit (all the dimension and founction) for each delivery. it can meet 8.2.2.3 Product audit requirement and 8.2.4.1 Layout inspection and founctionnal test?

We have a system of Product audit wherein we have specified to do the same once in a month time. Difference between Dock Audit (QS 9000 Terminology) and this Product Audit (TS 16949:2002 Terminology) is " audit of poducts at appropriate stages of production and delivery to all specified requirements, such as product dimensions, functionality and labeling at a defiend frequency" .

In dock audit it was for FINAL Labelling, Product Dimension, and other physical Characteristics.

We had a minimum of three Dock Audits per week established. Our TS auditor said that was fine and met the TS requirements for Product audits based on what we were doing. The key he tried to get accross was that dock audits were under inspection in QS and they are under auditing in TS. Inspections are different than audits as the audits are set up to be independent verification, and inspections are more direct dependant verifications.

Am I following the right path here?

Product Audits

Being an automotive supplier we use the AIAG definition for product audits: "The intent of this audit is verification that the control plan controls in different stages of production, including the shipping dock. This verifies that the control plan is followed and required checks are being performed." We walk the control plan once per year for each product produced. Additionally, once per quarter, we perform random dock audits, normally pulling 3 bins of parts to audit. Four of our plants have been recommended for TS certification with no findings and/or OFIs pertaining to the frequency.

Valeri said:

Being an automotive supplier we use the AIAG definition for product audits: "The intent of this audit is verification that the control plan controls in different stages of production, including the shipping dock. This verifies that the control plan is followed and required checks are being performed." We walk the control plan once per year for each product produced. Additionally, once per quarter, we perform random dock audits, normally pulling 3 bins of parts to audit. Four of our plants have been recommended for TS certification with no findings and/or OFIs pertaining to the frequency.

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Valeri,
Interesting. Where did you find that definition of "product audit"? I checked the web site and couldn't find it.

Product Audit

The definitions appear in the "Exploring ISO/TS 16949:2002" an ActionLine Special Edition. If you are a member of AIAG, it's free - if not it's $50.00. They get you coming and going!

Here are the other 2 they defined: Quality System Audit - The intent of this audit is to determine whether the overall system is effective. The auditor ensures the organization is moving toward its goals and objectives and that customer satisfaction metrics are satisfied. Process Audit - The process audit performs a "deep dive" into how each process actually works. This audit verifies the process is being followed.

Feel free to contact me via e-mail for other items of interest in this publication.