Crimpshrine13
Involved In Discussions
We're tier 2 automotive brake component manufacturing company. We have recently submitted a corrective action to CB on the NC that was found during re-certification audit and it was rejected.
The original NC stated that we did not do manufacturing process audit to verify the effectiveness and efficiency. So, we did some research and came up with the new manufacturing process audit checklist, conducted full manufacturing process audits, filled out new audit checklist, implemented additional methods to measure efficiency (machine uptime, plant utilization, etc.), and turned in the corrective action.
The issue only came up during this re-certification audit and was never mentioned by any of the previous auditors including the auditor who came to do readiness review 9 years ago. As a result, we never doubted that we were doing anything wrong, not to mention that we were never made aware of that VDA 6.3 was a requirement for manufacturing process audit.
Here's the auditor's quote:
Does anyone have any good idea how we should respond to this? Is VDA 6.3 required for ISO/TS 16949? We spent a lot of time searching for the answer for a month on this, but no one specifically talks about it being TS requirement.
Part of the reason for the rejection is, according to him, that we did not investigate "root cause including methodology used, analysis, and results, (5why, 3Legged 5why, fishbone, 8D etc)" and that "if an 8D is utilized it needs to be a full blown 8D not just a form labelled 8D. The 8Ds submitted do not show evidence of utilizing the full problem solving methodology."
Here's another thing he had mentioned:
"Our veto reviewers are taking a hard stance on this and I need to imbed in the follow-up report a copy of your form/process for each non-conformance. They have promised that any follow-up report that is lacking this information will be rejected regardless of the consequences on the certificate."
I just wondered if this is because of the our initial audit in July with an auditor who suspended the audit because he wrote 2 major NCs, which they later withdrew the report and re-did the full audit with another auditor. Or, they did something wrong in the past year that got caught by IATF or someone reported to IATF and suddenly requiring more than what is really required? I do not exactly what is going on, but things are not going too well with our follow-ups. Our cert expires on October 7, 2014, so I don't know what we can do at this moment. It's getting to the point that their demand is becoming more than what we can handle as a small company of less than 15 employees.
The original NC stated that we did not do manufacturing process audit to verify the effectiveness and efficiency. So, we did some research and came up with the new manufacturing process audit checklist, conducted full manufacturing process audits, filled out new audit checklist, implemented additional methods to measure efficiency (machine uptime, plant utilization, etc.), and turned in the corrective action.
The issue only came up during this re-certification audit and was never mentioned by any of the previous auditors including the auditor who came to do readiness review 9 years ago. As a result, we never doubted that we were doing anything wrong, not to mention that we were never made aware of that VDA 6.3 was a requirement for manufacturing process audit.
Here's the auditor's quote:
Manufacturing process audits ? There is no root cause determined ? Results of previous audits is not a root cause, The TS requirement is ?The organization shall audit each manufacturing process to determine its effectiveness?. VDA 6.3 is the guidance document that defines and describes an effective manufacturing process audit. Chrysler has recently clarified it?s expectation on Manufacturing Process Audits and those requirements are found within their CSR located on the IAOB website. Product layouts fall under other sections of the specification (8.2.2.3 and 8.2.4.1) and do not determine if the manufacturing process is effective only that it is producing parts to print. As noted in VDA guidance control plans are an input to the audit not the whole of the audit.
Does anyone have any good idea how we should respond to this? Is VDA 6.3 required for ISO/TS 16949? We spent a lot of time searching for the answer for a month on this, but no one specifically talks about it being TS requirement.
Part of the reason for the rejection is, according to him, that we did not investigate "root cause including methodology used, analysis, and results, (5why, 3Legged 5why, fishbone, 8D etc)" and that "if an 8D is utilized it needs to be a full blown 8D not just a form labelled 8D. The 8Ds submitted do not show evidence of utilizing the full problem solving methodology."
Here's another thing he had mentioned:
"Our veto reviewers are taking a hard stance on this and I need to imbed in the follow-up report a copy of your form/process for each non-conformance. They have promised that any follow-up report that is lacking this information will be rejected regardless of the consequences on the certificate."
I just wondered if this is because of the our initial audit in July with an auditor who suspended the audit because he wrote 2 major NCs, which they later withdrew the report and re-did the full audit with another auditor. Or, they did something wrong in the past year that got caught by IATF or someone reported to IATF and suddenly requiring more than what is really required? I do not exactly what is going on, but things are not going too well with our follow-ups. Our cert expires on October 7, 2014, so I don't know what we can do at this moment. It's getting to the point that their demand is becoming more than what we can handle as a small company of less than 15 employees.