Records Required by ISO 9001 - Audit Nonconformance - No record for 7.5.4

[fuzzy]

In my past lives I have created a simple form for this "record" or expressly stated in my Quality Manual that this record will be created when necessary...never been used by me in either case

[silentrunning]

I got bit on an audit because one of my customers had material sent directly from the mill to me. The mill shorted the order by 10% and I failed to notify the customer upon receipt of material. The customer was none too happy and the auditor dinged me for not treating it as lost material. I fought but the auditor won. I now track customers' material a lot more closely.

[AndyN]

If the auditor is saying that you haven't defined what record would be used, then maybe it's a bit 'picky' but possibly accurate. I don't read it that an actual record is missing, just a case of 'what would it be"?

Some orgs. use the same form as their own internal non-conformities would be recorded on, but have provision to make it clear it was customers' property.

[Jim Wynne]

In Reply to Parent Post by AndyN

If the auditor is saying that you haven't defined what record would be used, then maybe it's a bit 'picky' but possibly accurate. I don't read it that an actual record is missing, just a case of 'what would it be"?

Some orgs. use the same form as their own internal non-conformities would be recorded on, but have provision to make it clear it was customers' property.

I think it's altogether fitting that there should be an imaginary record for an imaginary requirement.

[somashekar]

In Reply to Parent Post by jhinckley

We fulfill the requriements of 7.5.4. Because our controls are tight, we have never had an instance of losing, damaging or finding files to be unsuitable for use. From my perspective, I can't produce a record if it hasn't happened.

You are perfect here.
However the auditor is looking for something else ... the system
What records IF made WHEN a customer property is lost or otherwise found unsuitable for use is not showing up in the procedure for control of records.
So, when such a record gets made in future, how does that record get the due control ?

[Randy]

7.1d?

Talk about low hanging fruit....And if there has been no reason to record anything, there is no need for a record....As was clearly stated...IF