The Checklist to ISO/TS16949-Is it a process audit or elemental?

[qualitytrec]

My new replacement is here now and we are having a bit of a debate. He says the Checklist is a process based audit format. I say that it is identical in application to the old QS-9000 elemental audit. What do you all say?

Mark

[Manoj Mathur]

I think there is no point of debate. In ISO/TS 16949, Both type of Audit Checklists are required. One checklist which we are using is based on Elements of TS2. I consider this is a generic checklist and if require, I can either mail it to you or post on this Forum. Another checklist is Process Audit checklist and Product Audit Checklist. Both checklists are based on Our Specific Process as well as Products. We have two seperate TS Certifications, one for Aluminum Alloy Wheel Rims and another one for Aluminum Foil. Since both pprocesses and products are different, we use four different checklists.

Manoj

[db]

The IAOB checklist was very similar to the QSA, so much so, that it is no longer used. If you have a copy, there is one thing that is very interesting. A graphic that outlines what parts of TS are process driven, and what parts are driven by documentation of information. For example, document control (4.2.3) is a process, but the quality manual (4.2.2) is document drivern.

As we develop/implement/audit our systems, we must be able to audit both the process-driven parts, and those parts that are not process oriented.

[qualitytrec]

Ok I can see that there is need of more info. My replacement is saying that the TS checklist is a process audit therefore we just need to go through it. By the way we are only going for ISO 9001 so there is a fair amount of overlooking that we would do.
I do have a checklist already made out that has only ISO elements in it. I do tend to agree that both elemental and process audits are necessary but some other threads have left me wondering. My lazy side hopes that they are right but my self-protective side is not willing to stick my neck out that far yet.

Mark

[Sam]

IMO, if you are not pursuing TS2, do not use a TS2 checklist. If you have your own ISO checklist, use it.
A checklist is a checklist is a checklist and should not be confused with the "art" of process auditing. The checklist that AIAG suggests is still an elemental checklist, regardless of how they try to color it.