The Elsmar Cove Forum and Site Map The Elsmar Cove Wiki More Free Files The Elsmar Cove Forums Discussion Thread Index Post Attachments Listing Failure Modes Services and Solutions to Problems Elsmar cove Forums Main Page Elsmar Cove Home Page

Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Manufacturing, Service, and Business Systems Processes > Service Industry Specific Topics


The Elsmar Cove Forum SideBar!
Monitor the Forum
Monitor New Forum Posts
New Threads Feeds
RSS FeedRSS Feed
Sponsor Link










$ Contributor Forum Access
Courtesy Quick Links

Links that Elsmar Cove visitors will find useful in your quest for knowledge:


Howard's International Quality Services

Atul's Symphony Technologies

Dave Scott's Scott Quality Solutions

Praxiom Research Group


NIST's Engineering Statistics Handbook

IRCA - International Register of Certified Auditors

SAE - Society of Automotive Engineers

Quality Digest Portal

IEST - Institute of Environmental Sciences and Technology

ASQ - American Society for Quality


All the Important Standards and Related Web Sites in the World
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Content Display Modes
  #1  
Old 13th April 2001, 03:02 PM
Bud
Unregistered Guest

 
Posts: n/a
Question Field M&TE Verifications - Technician visits customers sites - Electronic service

I work for a company that wants to send a technician to our customers' sites to perform electronic service and upgrades. This person travels with various electronic equipment that we have calibrated by an approved vendor once per year. I have a question about that equipment that is bound to be handled and mishandled through its many travels. Is it possible to perform some quick and easy verification of the test equipment in the field without doing a full-blown calibration/verification procedure? The equipment includes a multimeter to check continuity, a waveform generator, a hipot tester, and a portable oscilloscope. Does anybody has some ideas on quick and simple ways to verify in the field that the test equipment has not been damaged in transit? We want to catch problems with our own equipment before we use it on someone else's equipment. I'm hoping there are some electronic gurus out there that can assist me. Thank you in advance.
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 13th April 2001, 03:17 PM
Jerry Eldred's Avatar
Jerry Eldred Jerry Eldred is offline
Forum Moderator

Registration Date: Dec 1999
Location: Texas
 
Posts: 411
Thanks Given to Others: 0
Thanked 118 Times in 70 Posts
Karma Power: 89
Karma: 2042
Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
I'll take a stab at it.

The multimeter- If it's a handheld portable meter such as a Fluke 77 or 87 or similar, those are designed for field use any way. Something as simple as touching the test leads together for continuity check ought to be sufficient. If it's continuity testing, and you are using a less portable meter, the same method would apply, and look for a repeatable stable zero indication (minus lead resistance).

The wave form generator can be checked by putting a waveform on the oscilloscope. Use wave shape, amplitude and frequency similar to values you will be testing. Do this for a couple of different settings at the extremes of where your technician intends to use the generator.

The hipot tester, with nothing connected to the output can be run up it's voltage range, and watch for a predictable front panel meter display. Maybe before the first trip, just after the units have been freshly calibrated, make up a brief document as to what you run up to, what the dial setting is turned to (depending on what type of hipot you have), and verify when you turn the dial up to that position you get a full scale indication on the hipot. If its less than about a 50KV hipot this is fine. For some of the higher output voltage models (100KV for example), environmental conditions can make a difference on how high you can run it. Make sure to have adequate safety instructions in the document so noone gets unwanted electrons coursing through their body.

For the portable oscilloscope, many of them have a cal output that can be used for a self-check. Use the probe normally used in the field work, and check for proper waveform period, amplitude and risetime.

Please feel free to ask further if you need better elaboration on this.

------------------
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

  #3  
Old 16th April 2001, 01:27 PM
Bud
Unregistered Guest

 
Posts: n/a
Thumbs up

Thank you, Jerry, for your prompt reply. That is exactly the kind of information that I was looking for. Is there anything we can do if the portable oscilloscope does not have a cal output?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 16th April 2001, 01:49 PM
Jerry Eldred's Avatar
Jerry Eldred Jerry Eldred is offline
Forum Moderator

Registration Date: Dec 1999
Location: Texas
 
Posts: 411
Thanks Given to Others: 0
Thanked 118 Times in 70 Posts
Karma Power: 89
Karma: 2042
Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jerry Eldred is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
BIG Smile

That makes things even a little simpler. You can do what is sometimes called a "back-to-back" check. Set your generator for an appropriate output amplitud/waveform/frequency, and use it in lieu of the calibrator output.

Make sure to remember that this is NOT a calibration. It is a good confidence checker. Doing the back-to-back checks between the oscilloscope and the generator will give you some reasonable confidence level that they are both working properly. Odds are that if you have an erroneous decrease in the output level of the generator, you shouldn't have the same level of erroneous change in the oscilloscope input (we hope). If you get an incorrect display on the oscilloscope you can know with pretty good certainty that one or the other of the two are bad.

Conversely, if you get a "good" reading, you will have a pretty high degree of confidence that they are good.

One additional caution is to remember absolutely that these units are ONLY as good as their specs. If your vertical and horizontal specs on your scope are +/-2%, it will only read that well. If your generator amplitude is only +/-5%, it will ONLY read th at well. If you are checking them "back-to-back", you can ONLY expect readings within those limits. Your generator can legitimately change by 5% and still be good. Your scope could also drift by another 2% and still be good. You could see a change (in the example) of as much as 7% or more, and your instruments will still be "good." As you or your tech is checking them in the field, make sure to take into account the allowable specs of both instruments. If one was reading at the low end of spec and drifted all the way to the high end of its spec, it is still legitimate. Factor those quantities into your method for doing the checks in the field. Make your method such that you are only looking for equipment failures rather than legitimate instrument variation. As a calibration person, I have had to explain to many people these details. They used +/-2% meters and couldn't understand a 1% difference between two meters they used to check the same value. It is important to remember those details, and not deceive yourself into believing that test equipment is certified to remain "exact".

------------------
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 18th April 2001, 02:27 AM
Bud
Unregistered Guest

 
Posts: n/a
Screw

Thank you again, Jerry, for your valuable insight. I feel a lot better about our equipment traveling now that I have this information. This is without a doubt the best metrology forum I have seen and I hope it will be around for many years to come.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation Bar
Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Manufacturing, Service, and Business Systems Processes > Service Industry Specific Topics

Bookmarks


Visitors Currently Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 Registered Visitors and 1 Unregistered Guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Forum Search
Display Modes Rate Thread Content
Rate Thread Content:

Posting Settings
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Discussion Threads
Discussion Thread Title Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post or Poll Vote
Field Service - Database or Data Analysis of Repair Trends Desara01 Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 2 14th November 2008 07:34 AM
Electronic Records Transmission to Customers Ettore Records and Data - Quality, Legal and Other Evidence 8 6th October 2007 10:12 PM
Auditing of Installation of Product at Customers Sites chergh ISO 19011 and ALL Auditing Discussions 6 21st July 2005 05:20 AM
Customer Relationships - Visits from Competing Customers apestate Misc. Quality Assurance and Business Systems Related Topics 10 29th August 2003 09:33 AM
Service Level Agreements with Customers - What should these cover? Brian L Documentation Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 1 5th July 2001 10:17 AM



The time now is 06:17 AM. All times are GMT -4.
The time zone can be changed in your UserCP --> Options.



   

All Y'All Come Back Now, Y' Hear?

Made With A Mac! FreeBSD OS Powered by Apache!
Using php4 Forums provided and maintained by Marc Smith Database by MySQL

FAIR USE and CORRECTNESS NOTICE: This site contains copyrighted material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. We are making such material available in our efforts to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues, etc. We believe herein constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. For more information go to: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/ If you wish to use copyrighted material from this site for purposes of your own that go beyond 'fair use', you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. In addition, I do not guarantee the correctness of the content. The risk of using content from the Elsmar Cove web site and forums remains with the user/visitor.

Responsibility Statement: Each person is responsible for anything they post in the Elsmar Cove forum. Neither I, Marc Timothy Smith, nor any of the forum Moderators, are responsible for the content of posts people make. Liability for post content resides with the poster as does interpretation and/or acceptance and/or use of advice by the reader.

Complaints: If you have a complaint with a post in a forum discussion thread, including Content in general, fighting, flaming, copyright infringement, defamation and/or 'slander', please use the 'Report This Post Report This Post Button button which appears at the top of every post in every thread.

Site courtesy of:
Marc Timothy Smith - Cayman Business Systems, 8466 Lesourdsville-West Chester Road, West Chester, Ohio 45069-1929 - USA
(513) 341-6272

To contact me, click the Google Voice link below, enter Your Name and Your Phone Number and Google will ring your phone and connect you for free!

The Elsmar Cove Web Site is *CopyFree*
no new posts