The Elsmar Cove Forum and Site Map The Elsmar Cove Wiki More Free Files The Elsmar Cove Forums Discussion Thread Index Post Attachments Listing Failure Modes Services and Solutions to Problems Elsmar cove Forums Main Page Elsmar Cove Home Page

Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Aerospace and Aviation Requirements > AS9100 Aerospace Standard and Requirements


The Elsmar Cove Forum SideBar!
Monitor the Forum
Monitor New Forum Posts
New Threads Feeds
RSS FeedRSS Feed
Sponsor Link










$ Contributor Forum Access
Courtesy Quick Links

Links that Elsmar Cove visitors will find useful in your quest for knowledge:


Howard's International Quality Services

Atul's Symphony Technologies

Dave Scott's Scott Quality Solutions

Praxiom Research Group


NIST's Engineering Statistics Handbook

IRCA - International Register of Certified Auditors

SAE - Society of Automotive Engineers

Quality Digest Portal

IEST - Institute of Environmental Sciences and Technology

ASQ - American Society for Quality


All the Important Standards and Related Web Sites in the World
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Content Display Modes
  #1  
Old 26th October 2005, 08:19 AM
Angelika Angelika is offline
Involved - Posts

Registration Date: Nov 2004
Location: Germany
 
Posts: 80
Thanks Given to Others: 40
Thanked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Karma Power: 33
Karma: 569
Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.
Question Planning of product realization EN 9100 Clause 7.1 e

I need your help regarding the following requirement of EN/AS 9100, Sect. 7.1 e)

Identification of resources to support operation and maintenance of the product

Which action is required? Does it mean that companies have to issue operating and maintenance manuals? Does it have to do with after-sales-service? Somehow I am at a complete loss.

Any help is appreciated.
Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 26th October 2005, 09:51 AM
Justin's Avatar
Justin Justin is offline
E-Mails Invalid or Rejected

Registration Date: Sep 2005
Location: USA, New York
 
Posts: 72
Thanks Given to Others: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Karma Power: 0
Karma: 430
Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.
Default

AS9100 7.1(e) The identification of resources to support operation and maintenance of the product.

We have a flow diagram that identifies all the operations/processes.

For each process there is an operations manual to support the process.

There is also a maintenance manual for each process.

This is how we do it, and has satisfied our registrar thus far.

Hope it helps
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links

  #3  
Old 26th October 2005, 01:26 PM
Angelika Angelika is offline
Involved - Posts

Registration Date: Nov 2004
Location: Germany
 
Posts: 80
Thanks Given to Others: 40
Thanked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Karma Power: 33
Karma: 569
Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.
Default

Thanks a lot Justin, your reply was a great help to me!
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 26th October 2005, 01:34 PM
Justin's Avatar
Justin Justin is offline
E-Mails Invalid or Rejected

Registration Date: Sep 2005
Location: USA, New York
 
Posts: 72
Thanks Given to Others: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 1 Post
Karma Power: 0
Karma: 430
Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.Justin is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.
Default

Any time Angelika

I have been through several AS/EN 9100 registration audits and implementations. I am happy to share my experiences, good and bad.

Keep smiling
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 26th January 2007, 11:46 AM
RCW's Avatar
RCW RCW is offline
Involved - Posts

Registration Date: Oct 2001
Location: IL
 
Posts: 261
Thanks Given to Others: 11
Thanked 11 Times in 10 Posts
Karma Power: 41
Karma: 157
RCW is appreciated, and has over 100 Karma points.RCW is appreciated, and has over 100 Karma points.
Default Re: 7.1 Planning of product realization EN 9100

Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post

AS9100 7.1(e) The identification of resources to support operation and maintenance of the product.

We have a flow diagram that identifies all the operations/processes.

For each process there is an operations manual to support the process.

There is also a maintenance manual for each process.

This is how we do it, and has satisfied our registrar thus far.

Hope it helps
I have read and re-read this reply several times in an attempt to figure out what 7.1(e) is asking for. (Maybe I just can't make the analogy between Justin's answer and the manfacturing processes within my own company.)

From one of the many books I am using to try to make sense of AS9100:
"A requirement is added as section (e) to places (sp?) emphasis on the long term and lifecycle of a product including support and maintenance. Aerospace parts usually have a long lifecycle, and require traceability from specification to disposal. Design has to consider the user."

If I am performing build-to-print/contract manufacturing of the customer's designs, is 7.1(e) even applicable to me? To me, it looks like the development/control/distribution of operation and maintenance manuals for products are required.

Can somebody attempt to clear this up?

Last edited by RCW; 26th January 2007 at 01:02 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 26th January 2007, 12:16 PM
Jeff Frost Jeff Frost is offline
Involved - Posts

Registration Date: May 2004
Location: Orange County, California
 
Posts: 383
Thanks Given to Others: 69
Thanked 125 Times in 94 Posts
Karma Power: 46
Karma: 806
Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.Jeff Frost is appreciated, and has over 700 Karma points.
Default Re: 7.1 Planning of product realization EN 9100

Ok let me try this one for you.

ISO 9001:2000 is not specific regarding maintenance of the product, whereas EN9100 (known as AS9100 in North America) does. The “resources” would include personnel, equipment, repair parts, and/or machine repair, tooling for performing the maintenance.

Examples would be aircraft engines, avionics, hydraulic systems or product that can be rebuilt on the aircraft. It should be noted that not all product fall within this requirement such as machine to order parts or expendable parts such as o-ring seals.

In reality for most companies that are only machining parts to order or are supplying expendable parts they only have to maintain the ability to make more of them when needed by the customer.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 27th January 2007, 04:23 AM
Angelika Angelika is offline
Involved - Posts

Registration Date: Nov 2004
Location: Germany
 
Posts: 80
Thanks Given to Others: 40
Thanked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Karma Power: 33
Karma: 569
Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.Angelika is appreciated, and has over 500 Karma points.
Default Re: 7.1 Planning of product realization EN 9100

In the meantime, I have had a lot to do with Design Organisations that mainly design changes to approved type design of Aircraft.

My today's thoughts when reading this paragraph again are the following:

1. What means do I need to achieve initial airworthiness and how can it be achieved?
2. What means do I need to achieve continued airworthiness and how can it be achieved?

Following this I would start in the design phase because the Design Organisation is the one that determines how a product must be produced, operated and maintained to ensure correct and safe operation.

1. How to achieve initial airworthiness:
As a result of prototyping the Design Organisation must clearly specify
a) the manufacturing programs including any relevant drawings/diagrams etc.
b) the operating manuals
c) the maintenance manuals
d) the installation manuals etc.

2. How to achieve continued airworthiness:
If there is a need to change the Design (improvements, airworthiness matters etc.) there must be a system that makes sure that
a) the manufacturer
b) the operator/user of the product
c) those maintaining the product
(if airworthiness is touched, of course the aviation authority, too)
are informed of the relevant changes in due time.


Depending on the type of product, any means required to support production, operation and maintenance of the product must be specified during the design yet. This also includes a systematic reporting system between the parties.

Looking forward to your comments.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 31st January 2007, 06:12 AM
kiwisfly kiwisfly is offline
Registered Visitor

Registration Date: Jan 2006
Location: New Zealand
 
Posts: 99
Thanks Given to Others: 7
Thanked 74 Times in 20 Posts
Karma Power: 26
Karma: 478
kiwisfly is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.kiwisfly is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.kiwisfly is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.kiwisfly is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.kiwisfly is appreciated, and has over 400 Karma points.
Default Re: 7.1 Planning of product realization EN 9100

Hi All
I think the thread explains the requirement of 7.1.e very well. If I could add that the requirement I believe follows the Rule Part 21 requirement that the designer and/or manufacturer of an aircraft, system or component is responsible for the component's continued airworthiness as approved through the Part 21 process. For example, if you are the OEM for an aircraft type and hold the type certificate, then under Part 21 you are bound to support that aircraft whilst it is being operated. Hence the AS9100 requirement to consider support activities to support the ongoing operation and maintenance of the aircraft. The process similarly flows down to system and component approval holders. Note, this may or may not be the designer, just as manufacturing can be contracted out, so too can design.

If a build-to-print manufacturer excludes 7.1.e then I believe this would be acceptable under the requirements of AS9100.

I hope this helps.

Cheers
Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation Bar
Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Aerospace and Aviation Requirements > AS9100 Aerospace Standard and Requirements

Bookmarks


Visitors Currently Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 Registered Visitors and 1 Unregistered Guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Forum Search
Display Modes Rate Thread Content
Rate Thread Content:

Posting Settings
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Discussion Threads
Discussion Thread Title Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post or Poll Vote
Planning of Product Realization - Risk Management - ISO 13485 Clause 7.1 vinhhoang ISO 13485 - Medical Devices - Quality Management Systems 6 21st July 2008 09:33 PM
AS9120 - Should planning of product realization be excluded? Sidney Vianna AS9100 Aerospace Standard and Requirements 1 10th March 2007 08:10 PM
Planning of Product Realization (Quality Plans) - Clause 7.1 Henriqued ISO 9001 - Quality Management Systems Standard 9 25th March 2006 05:00 PM
Planning for Product Realization example form, template or checklist DWPOZE Documentation Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 6 28th February 2006 11:27 AM
TS 16949 - 5.4 Planning, 7.1 Planning of product realization, 7.5.1.1 Control Plan Rosana ISO/TS 16949 - International Automotive Quality Systems Standard 2 20th August 2002 09:57 AM



The time now is 10:18 PM. All times are GMT -4.
The time zone can be changed in your UserCP --> Options.



   

All Y'All Come Back Now, Y' Hear?

Made With A Mac! FreeBSD OS Powered by Apache!
Using php4 Forums provided and maintained by Marc Smith Database by MySQL

FAIR USE and CORRECTNESS NOTICE: This site contains copyrighted material the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. We are making such material available in our efforts to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democracy, scientific, and social justice issues, etc. We believe herein constitutes a 'fair use' of any such copyrighted material as provided for in section 107 of the US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed without profit to those who have expressed a prior interest in receiving the included information for research and educational purposes. For more information go to: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/17/ If you wish to use copyrighted material from this site for purposes of your own that go beyond 'fair use', you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. In addition, I do not guarantee the correctness of the content. The risk of using content from the Elsmar Cove web site and forums remains with the user/visitor.

Responsibility Statement: Each person is responsible for anything they post in the Elsmar Cove forum. Neither I, Marc Timothy Smith, nor any of the forum Moderators, are responsible for the content of posts people make. Liability for post content resides with the poster as does interpretation and/or acceptance and/or use of advice by the reader.

Complaints: If you have a complaint with a post in a forum discussion thread, including Content in general, fighting, flaming, copyright infringement, defamation and/or 'slander', please use the 'Report This Post Report This Post Button button which appears at the top of every post in every thread.

Site courtesy of:
Marc Timothy Smith - Cayman Business Systems, 8466 Lesourdsville-West Chester Road, West Chester, Ohio 45069-1929 - USA
(513) 341-6272

To contact me, click the Google Voice link below, enter Your Name and Your Phone Number and Google will ring your phone and connect you for free!

The Elsmar Cove Web Site is *CopyFree*
no new posts