The Elsmar Cove Wiki More Free Files The Elsmar Cove Forums Discussion Thread Index Post Attachments Listing Failure Modes Services and Solutions to Problems Elsmar cove Forums Main Page Elsmar Cove Home Page

Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Manufacturing, Service, and Business Systems Processes > Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams
Forum Username


Elsmar Cove Forum Sidebar
Custom Search
Monitor the Elsmar Forum
Monitor New Forum Posts
Follow Marc & Elsmar
Elsmar Cove Forum RSS Feed  Marc Smith's Google+ Page  Marc Smith's Linked In Page   Marc Smith's Elsmar Cove YouTube Page  Marc Smith's Facebook Page
Elsmar Cove Groups
Elsmar Cove Google+ Group  Elsmar Cove LinkedIn Group  Elsmar Cove Facebook Group
Sponsor Links







Donate and $ Contributor Forum Access
Sponsored Links
Courtesy Quick Links

Links that Elsmar Cove visitors will find useful in your quest for knowledge:


Howard's
International Quality Services

Atul's
Symphony Technologies

Marcelo Antunes'
SQR Consulting

Bob Doering's
Correct SPC - Precision Machining


NIST's Engineering Statistics Handbook

IRCA - International Register of Certified Auditors

SAE - Society of Automotive Engineers

Quality Digest Portal

IEST - Institute of Environmental Sciences and Technology

ASQ - American Society for Quality

View Poll Results: What IS a 'process map' to you?
It illustrates MULTIPLE processes (eg, flowchart, diagram or similar) 30 26.79%
It describes MULTIPLE processes (mainly or all text) 5 4.46%
It shows MULTIPLE processes (combines graphics/diagram & text descriptions) 17 15.18%
Sets out a SINGLE process only, graphically (eg, flowchart etc) 19 16.96%
Describes a SINGLE process only, in text 2 1.79%
It can show either MULTIPLE processes, or a SINGLE process 51 45.54%
I don't really know 2 1.79%
I avoid 'process maps' 1 0.89%
There's no difference between a 'process map' and a documented 'procedure' 4 3.57%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 112. You may not vote on this poll


Related Topic Tags
process mapping
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 5.00 average. Display Modes
  #1  
Old 23rd July 2008, 08:46 PM
JaneB's Avatar
JaneB JaneB is offline
Consultant / Auditor

 
Registration Date: Feb 2006
Location: Melbourne, Australia
 
Posts: 3,413
Thanks Given to Others: 1,301
Thanked 1,680 Times in 1,108 Posts
Karma Power: 393
Karma: 11407
JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.JaneB is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Question What IS a Process Map?

What do you mean by a 'process map'? A few discussions in a couple of recent threads reminded me that this term is often used to mean different things, which can be very confusing for the 'uninitiated'.

I'm interested to see if there's a broad consensus of meaning (or not), and what people think a process map 'should' be / contain / look like.
__________________
people call me a feminist whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from a doormat. Rebecca West

Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 23rd July 2008, 09:20 PM
William Gr's Avatar
William Gr William Gr is offline
Involved in Discussions

 
Registration Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
 
Posts: 13
Thanks Given to Others: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Karma Power: 27
Karma: 10
William Gr has less than 100 Karma points so far.
Re: What IS a process map?

It all depends on what you are trying to map! As higher level processes will break off into smaller ones. For example, process mapping new product development. Many areas in the company each with thier own smaller process will become part of the bigger map. On the simpler end is a process map for making the morning coffee, were everything is local and can flow in sequencial events. In both cases. the map should be a step by step recreation of actual events, including decision points.
__________________
WILLIAM
Sponsored Links

  #3  
Old 23rd July 2008, 10:18 PM
Jim Wynne's Avatar
Jim Wynne Jim Wynne is offline
Cross Forum Moderator

 
Registration Date: Jan 2005
Location: Southeast Wisconsin
 
Posts: 13,323
Thanks Given to Others: 1,778
Thanked 5,332 Times in 3,423 Posts
Blog Entries: 2
Karma Power: 1444
Karma: 39104
Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Jim Wynne is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Re: What IS a process map?

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by JaneB View Post

What do you mean by a 'process map'? A few discussions in a couple of recent threads reminded me that this term is often used to mean different things, which can be very confusing for the 'uninitiated'.

I'm interested to see if there's a broad consensus of meaning (or not), and what people think a process map 'should' be / contain / look like.
In general, process maps are confused masses of symbols, arrows and text that purport to explicate the interactions of processes. In most cases they do nothing of the kind and serve mainly to have something shiny and colorful to present to a CB auditor as evidence of understanding process interactions. Give me good ol' logically derived process flow diagrams any time. Or better yet, actually describe in writing how processes interact.
__________________
We aim to please. You aim too, please.
Thank You to Jim Wynne for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  #4  
Old 24th July 2008, 12:19 AM
Stijloor's Avatar
Stijloor Stijloor is offline
Cross Forum Moderator

 
Registration Date: May 2003
Location: Charlotte, North Carolina.
 
Posts: 13,409
Thanks Given to Others: 2,942
Thanked 4,268 Times in 3,025 Posts
Karma Power: 1428
Karma: 23887
Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Stijloor is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Re: What IS a process map?

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Jim Wynne View Post

In general, process maps are confused masses of symbols, arrows and text that purport to explicate the interactions of processes. In most cases they do nothing of the kind and serve mainly to have something shiny and colorful to present to a CB auditor as evidence of understanding process interactions. Give me good ol' logically derived process flow diagrams any time. Or better yet, actually describe in writing how processes interact.
I believe that "a picture is worth a thousand words." The problem is that folks developing these process maps are trying to cram way too much information on an 8.5 x 11 (or an A4) piece of paper. The scope of the map is not set right so it becomes indeed a "mass of symbols, arrows and text."

The new AIAG FMEA 4th Ed. manual shows a neat (simple) example of how a process map (high level) can be broken up into separate flow charts (lower level).

But then again, I am a picture guy...

Stijloor.
  #5  
Old 24th July 2008, 01:08 AM
joshua_sx1's Avatar
joshua_sx1 joshua_sx1 is offline
Involved in Discussions

 
Registration Date: Apr 2008
 
Posts: 325
Thanks Given to Others: 19
Thanked 59 Times in 51 Posts
Karma Power: 53
Karma: 274
joshua_sx1 is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.joshua_sx1 is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.joshua_sx1 is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.
Re: What IS a process map?



process map – is an overall methodology plan of how each major activity within an organization interact or connected with each other…

...then describing the detailed of how each major activity shall be carried-out can be done using flowcharts, procedures and/or working instructions… (and as required) supported by forms to have an evidence that they were performed accordingly…
__________________
"Anything you cannot measure, you cannot control"
  #6  
Old 24th July 2008, 03:11 AM
Peter Fraser's Avatar
Peter Fraser Peter Fraser is offline
Appreciated Member

 
Registration Date: Sep 2003
Location: ABERDEEN, SCOTLAND, UK
 
Posts: 413
Thanks Given to Others: 24
Thanked 140 Times in 101 Posts
Karma Power: 83
Peter Fraser has disabled his/her Karma.
Re: What IS a process map?

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by JaneB View Post

What do you mean by a 'process map'? A few discussions in a couple of recent threads reminded me that this term is often used to mean different things, which can be very confusing for the 'uninitiated'.

I'm interested to see if there's a broad consensus of meaning (or not), and what people think a process map 'should' be / contain / look like.
Jane

About time too, thanks! The use of the term has been causing confusion for far too long - have you ever been in a meeting and discovered after a couple of hours that someone is talking about something different from what you thought, because they are using a term that you thought "everyone knows what that means" but they use it differently? Or (even) reading posts in a forum for years and then suddenly realising that some posters are doing the same!

As is often the case, there is no "right" answer. Deming talked of "operational definitions" - what terms mean in a particular context. The important thing is that the meaning is understood by everyone, and that isn't the case here.

And other examples make it worse ... a "town map" and a "street map" are probably the same thing - ie a map (a visual or diagrammatic representation) of a town, made up of streets. But you wouldn't talk of a "town map" if you meant a map of a country which showed the main towns.

To me, if a "map" is a "visual or diagrammatic representation" of what is mapped, then the ideal would be to call the "picture" of your management system a "system map", and reserve "process map" (or similar) for the description of an individual process.

What is also important is why these various types of "map" are produced - I have seen enough (bad) examples to suggest that many of them confuse rather than clarify, and often they are produced because the author thinks that they have to draw one rather than because their target audience will gain benefit.
__________________
Peter
"Insight through Clarity"
Thanks to Peter Fraser for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  #7  
Old 24th July 2008, 05:02 AM
Umang Vidyarthi Umang Vidyarthi is offline
Courtesy Access

 
Registration Date: Mar 2007
Location: Gurgaon / India
Age: 67
 
Posts: 875
Thanks Given to Others: 374
Thanked 447 Times in 249 Posts
Karma Power: 121
Karma: 4366
Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.Umang Vidyarthi is appreciated, and has over 1700 Karma points.
Yin Yang Re: What IS a process map?

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by JaneB View Post

What do you mean by a 'process map'? A few discussions in a couple of recent threads reminded me that this term is often used to mean different things, which can be very confusing for the 'uninitiated'.

I'm interested to see if there's a broad consensus of meaning (or not), and what people think a process map 'should' be / contain / look like.
A 'Process Map' is a bird's eye view of a process or processes, giving you broad information about the process in one shot. Just like a picture.

BTW the 'uninitiated' also get confused with synonymous terms viz: Process flow diagram, process flow chart, process model etcetra.

Umang
__________________
Quality has to be caused, not controlled.-Philip Crosby
Success comes in cans, failure in can'ts
  #8  
Old 24th July 2008, 05:11 AM
Bifften Bifften is offline
Involved in Discussions

 
Registration Date: Jun 2008
Location: Hertfordshire UK
Age: 29
 
Posts: 47
Thanks Given to Others: 29
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Karma Power: 24
Karma: 232
Bifften is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.Bifften is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.Bifften is appreciated, and has over 200 Karma points.
Re: What IS a process map?

My understanding and use of the term "Process Map" is something that shows a single process (be it macro (high level) or micro (low level). These maps can include graphics, symbols and text descriptions.

I can and do have several processes which means several "Process Maps" which can all be related / linked.
Reply

Lower Navigation Bar
Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Forum > Manufacturing, Service, and Business Systems Processes > Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams

Do you find this discussion thread helpful and informational?


Bookmarks


Visitors Currently Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 Registered Visitors (Members) and 1 Unregistered Guest Visitors)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Forum Search
Display Modes Rate Thread Content
Rate Thread Content:

Forum Posting Settings
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Discussion Threads
Discussion Thread Title Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post or Poll Vote
Linking Business Process Map with Sub-Process Process Map Neil V. Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 33 30th January 2013 04:01 PM
Process Mapping - for "Audits" - Detailed process map + macro map + FMEA abhipatel Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 10 27th July 2009 10:48 PM
Business process map - Please Review my Process Map and Turtle Diagram phomer Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 31 16th July 2007 09:35 PM
Using a Value Stream Map as High Level Process Map Dizzydom Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 5 30th May 2007 02:20 PM
Flow chart vs. Process map vs. Value stream map - What are the differences? pradeep sharma Process Maps, Process Mapping and Turtle Diagrams 4 16th December 2005 02:24 PM



The time now is 03:59 PM. All times are GMT -4.
Your time zone can be changed in your UserCP --> Options.


   


Marc Timothy Smith - Elsmar.com
8466 LeSourdsville-West Chester Road, West Chester, Ohio 45069-1929
513 341-6272