Which kind of document is the Quality Policy?

[Randy]

The current policy falls under 4.2.3, the old policy falls under 4.2.4.

[selena15]

ok Randy
I got it, it is a document not record but which kind of ?
it is really not possible to involve it into any kind of document that i discribed above ?

[Jim Wynne]

In Reply to Parent Post by selena15

ok Randy
I got it, it is a document not record but which kind of ?
it is really not possible to involve it into any kind of document that i discribed above ?

Don't confuse the container with the thing it contains. You can categorize it however you want to, and it won't alter the content of the document, or its purpose. Either create a new category or shoehorn it into an existing category--either way, it's the same document.

[JaneB]

As Jim says, if you have to 'shoehorn' it into an existing type, then do.

But for my part, I think any classification is a rather strange one if it doesn't allow for any Policy. (But yes, I DO understand that changing an embedded system could be difficult! You could probably argue for several different types - I'd be inclined toward a 'specification' on the grounds that it 'specifies' what should be done at a very high level, but I"m sure there's other points of view.

I wouldn't spend a lot of time worrying about it - and no, you definitely don't have to give it a number or a code or anything like that.

To take a leaf out of Randy's book, you could even call it 'Jack & Jill Go up the Hill' and make it a 'form' type, provided the content has what is required. Though I wouldn't recommend this approach & it might take a little bit of explaining to your people & your auditor if you did though

[Randy]

In Reply to Parent Post by selena15

ok Randy
I got it, it is a document not record but which kind of ?
it is really not possible to involve it into any kind of document that i discribed above ?

You're worrying over nits........It's just a required document within your management system and you have to control it as such. It doesn't matter what it looks like, smells like feels like or tastes like....it's just a document.

The current policy states what you intend to do and an old, no longer valid policy states what you had intended to do. One is present and the other past.

[qualitymanager]

In Reply to Parent Post by Colpart

Quality Manager, I think you are confusing the issue unnecessarily with your comment about the policy being a record. Using the same logic, should we say that the internal audit procedure is evidence of meeting the requirement of clause 8.2.2? I don't think so myself.

Within the context of subsequent posts, I will accept that my comment about the Quality Policy being a record is now confusing the issue.

Out of the context of what this thread has become, please explain why you disagree with the following:

Requirement: "A documented procedure shall be established to define" (ref ISO 9001 8.2.2)

Definition of a Record: document ... providing evidence of activities performed

Conclusion: A documented procedure is a record providing evidence that the requirements of ISO 9001 8.2.2 have been met (for "establish and document", not implement, ref. ISO 9001 4.1)

In Reply to Parent Post by Colpart

I differentiate the terms document and record to avoid the confusion. I think the fact that the requirement you quote in 4.2.3 points us to 4.2.4 is evidence enough don't you?

I submit that a record is a type of document (please see ISO 9000 and partitive relationships) and to say X is a record, not a document is not in line with the statement in 4.2.4.

[qualitymanager]

In Reply to Parent Post by selena15

I'm agree with you Colpart about what is a record. But as well as our documentation system require to define the kind of the document ( WI, procedure, Record, Forms, specifications...etc ) this is why i think to make it as record. i know that normally the record is kept in store or what ever when the Quality policy is alive document but which kind of document it is ?
specifications as one fellow suggested ??

Please list all the categories for documents within your QMS, then I will be able to say if it fits into an existing category, or if you should create a new one.

[Colin]

I am not sure why you are complicating the matter. An internal audit procedure is a document which informs the reader of the method of performing audits, this procedure needs to be kept current and therefore subject to document control.

Part of that procedure will be a requirement to keep certain records e.g. audit findings to demonstrate that the procedure was followed.