Baldrige replacing ISO 9000?

I have heard rumblings from various sources that many companies are looking at dropping their ISO certifications and going with MBQA requirements. Is this a trend you folks are seeing?

[Marc]

I haven't. Remember that the Baldrige is an 'award' and ISO9001 is a 'specification'. Balrige criteria and ISO to some degree overlap. Have you seen http://Elsmar.com/level2/baldrige.html ?

[Andy Bassett]

I thought nobody would ever mention this subject. The European equivalent of the Baldridge Award is called the Business Excellence Model.

I have not heard anything about companies dropping ISO in favour of it, but on this subject i would like to add a couple of comments.

MBQA is generally far superior to ISO/QS as a measurement of a Business's capabilities, unless someone very foresighted has implemented ISO/QS with one eye on the Human factors (communications/leadership etc), and has built these things in the QMS.

MBQA is generally much more difficult to implement than ISO, and could be considered one step further up the improvement tree.

I say generally because it depends on the culture in which you are operating. Some companies/countries are comfortable with the idea of documenting something to death, and trun their nose up at 'Touchy feely' subjects like strategy.
Others feel that you can have as many systems or documents as you want, they are no subject for good leadership and a sound strategy.

I suppose the truth lies somewhere between the two, its still here the arguements that people can develop to promote their own view of which direction is correct,

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Andy B

Thanks for the information. I'll have to do
my homework and determine where we stand with the MBQA requirements.

[Marc]

Andy - Thanks for your input.

Brenda - Sorry so few responses. Not many MBQA folks come here.

I am an internal "subject matter expert (SME)" in the implementation of a business excellence similar to MBNQA criteria to many of our ISO certified companies. From my four years experience in this area, none of our company drops ISO and march towards MBNQA criteria. In fact, ISO QMS serves as a perfect foundation to implement MBNQA criteria because it emphased greatly on "how" things are done which may be in the form of a process. Similarly, ISO focus on process.
However, MBNQA requirement is far more macro and forward looking in driving for business excellence as compared to ISO which deal with "compliance" to your procedures you have set.
On the other hand, I am looking forward to forum partner to share their experice in this field.

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Thanks and Best Regards

lmfoong

[This message has been edited by lmfoong (edited 12 September 2000).]

[Andy Bassett]

Well yes and no

'Processes' is just one of 9 main criteria in the Business Excellence Model (BEM), so the link between something that is essentially process oriented like ISO, and something that covers many other areas like BEM should not be that strong.

On the other hand, if a company has sufficient 'Go-Ahead' in them to even consider obtaining ISO, then they are probably having a look with one eye at their strategic position in relation to their competitors, and starting to get in more of the BEM criteria
Additionally, when a company has implemented something like ISO with a reasonable amount of success, they automatically look around for the next step ie BEM.

Lastly as a customer i would view a company carrying out assessment to the BEM MUCH more positively than a company that tells me they have ISO, but that could be just me.

Regards

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Andy B

[This message has been edited by Andy Bassett (edited 14 September 2000).]

[gpainter]

ISO 9001-2000 is the baseline, ISO 9004-2000 is the next level, MBNQA is next