Supplier PPAP Requirements - Level 3 or Level 4

[KWB64]

When requesting a PPAP subission of a supplier, it is common that not all elements will apply. For example, if the supplier is not design responsible I would not expact a DFMEA submission from them. Even though the DFMEA will not be a part of the PPAP (retained or submitted), I would still consider the submission to be a level 3. I recently had someone tell me that actually this would be a level 4. What are your thoughts?

Thanks!

[Jim Wynne]

Originally Posted by KWB64

When requesting a PPAP subission of a supplier, it is common that not all elements will apply. For example, if the supplier is not design responsible I would not expact a DFMEA submission from them. Even though the DFMEA will not be a part of the PPAP (retained or submitted), I would still consider the submission to be a level 3. I recently had someone tell me that actually this would be a level 4. What are your thoughts?

Thanks!

It can be either 3 or 4. The submission level doesn't matter so long as the supplier understands what elements are required. Some companies deal with this by using a checklist (sent to the supplier) that shows all of the elements and what to do with each--submit, retain, or N/A.

[Howard Atkins]

Originally Posted by KWB64

When requesting a PPAP subission of a supplier, it is common that not all elements will apply. For example, if the supplier is not design responsible I would not expact a DFMEA submission from them. Even though the DFMEA will not be a part of the PPAP (retained or submitted), I would still consider the submission to be a level 3. I recently had someone tell me that actually this would be a level 4. What are your thoughts?

Thanks!

All requirements that are relevant apply in level 3.

PPAP handbook 2.2
NOTE: Items or records from 2.2.1 through 2.2.18 may not necessarily apply to every customer part number from every organization. For example, some parts do not have appearance requirements, others do not have color requirements, and plastic parts may have polymeric part marking requirements. In order to determine with certainty which items must be included, consult the design record, e.g., part print, the relevant Engineering documents or specifications, and your authorized customer representative.

Submission level refer to the documents to be submitted all items relevant MUST be performed no matter what Submission level
is required.

Submission level
Level 3 is all relevant items.
Level 4 is when the customer decides that he only wants to receive certain documents

Too many times the levels are used as an excuse not to do the work.

[Stijloor]

Friends,

Interesting to notice what the intended purpose is of PPAP and how automotive suppliers view it.

Stijloor.

[bobdoering]

Originally Posted by Stijloor

Interesting to notice what the intended purpose is of PPAP and how automotive suppliers view it.

Yes, some still think the only part you have to do is the part you submit. Nope...nowhere near. The best thing for any customer is to supply a checklist. To benchmark the best, I had a Japanese customer that would number the print (or use the numbered print from previous submissions - that sure is handy - and list which dimensions were to be checked with a 5 pc layout, which they wanted more data from - maybe 15 pc - and which they wanted capability on. Communicating your needs to your supplier...kooky new idea! Sometimes customers are as lazy as suppliers.