WHERE do you find your internal auditors?

[Claes Gefvenberg]

I'm curious...as you all know Where (in which departments / functions) do you find your infernal... sorry, internal auditors?

/Claes

[Randy Stewart]

My department is responsible for the internal audits. We have "ad hoc" auditors from various departments also. The Quality and Operations Engineering Department is made up of an Industrial Engineer, a Quality Engineer, a Six Sigma Black Belt, our Scheduling/Capacity expert and a Product Design Engineer.
The feeling of the shop and employees is that if you are "chosen" (I don't have a whole lot of say in who is promoted into my department) for the QOE department you are a glutton for punishment! We are involved in all aspects of the company and are required to be both diplomats and problem solvers.

To give you an example of the requirements placed on this department: One of our customers found a design flaw in one of their trucks (not our design or area). Our company was approached to correct the problem and since the truck is already in production it was a hurry up job. Our designers created a part to fix the problem and we were told that we would be the supplier of this new part. That was on 4/23! My department was asked to help with developing the process flow (no problem) and then the bomb fell!!! Initial run to stop the bleeding = 350 due in 3 weeks; targeted quantities needed until a full design change can be implemented at shut down = 50,000 to 90,000; PSW due by 5/1!
We are a prototype stamping plant and this is a job for a production screw machine shop. Not only are we going through APQP/run at rate, etc. but I'm in the middle of a surveillance and 9k2k registration and our Black Belt is presenting his last project for his "Master Black Belt" designation this week. You gotta love the challenge.

[Sam]

I have four auditors, one each selected from engineering, production ,administration and qc.

[Bob_M]

We use all the office personnel (6), and production employees as we can get them.

[Randy]

As most of you may be aware I perform a whole lot of training for a couple of the major ISO training organizations. Since Jan 1, I have probably taught 6-8 I/A courses for QMS and EMS and next week I am doing and Integrated Systems I/A and a Safety System (OHSAS 18001) I/A course and an EMS-LA course the following week.

The vast majority of the folks taking the courses I teach are either Quality, Environmental or Engineer types. I have seen 1 or 2 HR, Mgmt and some others, but they are the exception and not the rule.

I think one of the reasons that many I/A programs are weak is the lack of a broad, cross funtional spectrum amonst Internal Auditors. It's not the fault of the folks performing the audits, but most of the time people will tend to focus on what they know and are comfortable with and will overlook areas or processes outside of thier personal career functions.

[Claes Gefvenberg]

Randy said:
---X---
I think one of the reasons that many I/A programs are weak is the lack of a broad, cross funtional spectrum amonst Internal Auditors. It's not the fault of the folks performing the audits, but most of the time people will tend to focus on what they know and are comfortable with and will overlook areas or processes outside of thier personal career functions.

Exactly... which as you obviously realized is why I asked about this in the first place...

Next question is: How do we get the other groups interested in taking part?

/Claes

[Randy]

Each group, individual, area, function or whatever you want to call it has to 1st be shown their personal (meaning the aforementioned whatever's) benefits and 2ndly have some sense of ownership instilled within them.

Time has to be taken to show how the IA process is the single most important process in the organization (my theory and what I teach/preach). These seperate whatever's need to be shown how it takes fresh and different approaches and views on issues to detect opportunities for improvement and maybe uncover those N/C's that are out there. I'm a firm believer that the worst people to do the I/A's for QMS and EMS are the Q and Env folks. Q & Env types are for the most part locked into the state of "Tunopia" I have talked about, they're inflexable in their thinking and vision.

What one has to be is a cheerleader, team builder, project manager, and many other things to get people involved. We have to be excited and keep things exciting. I wish I could put into words here what I mean.

A major part of the problems is a lack of esprit de corps on the part of Internal Auditors. They are not made to feel important and special to the organization. There isn't any pride in much of what they do. We have to bring out that pride (the right kind).

I spend a great deal of time pumping up the folks that attend the courses I instruct. I wish I could share the comments with you to show you what I mean. You have to do the same.

[Bill Ryan - 2007]

We, typically, find our IAs from the "rank & file" - could be from any department. Just recently, we have involved senior management (even the CEO is "required" to perform a process audit once monthly It's kinda funny that his CARs get answered on time - every time )

Bill