Chrysler Specific TS 16949 Requirement

[SarahF]

Chrysler specific: somewhere I read that all chrysler suppliers must be TS by july 2004. but now I can't find it.
I heard at their supplier training in april they said only tier 1 suppliers, didn't care about tier 2.
can that be correct?
thanks for your help

[howste]

From the DaimlerChrysler - Specific requirements dated 1/7/03: All Production and Service Part organizations to DaimlerChrysler shall be Third-Party Registered to ISO/TS 16949 Second Edition by 4 July 2004."

This applies to those directly supplying to Chrysler. TS 16949:2002 requires that companies certified to that standard require their suppliers to be 3rd party certified to ISO 9001:2000 at a minimum (with a goal of compliance to TS 16949).

[howste]

Oops, forgot the linky to the requirements.

[xfngrs]

Originally Posted by howste

From the DaimlerChrysler - Specific requirements dated 1/7/03: All Production and Service Part organizations to DaimlerChrysler shall be Third-Party Registered to ISO/TS 16949 Second Edition by 4 July 2004."

This applies to those directly supplying to Chrysler. TS 16949:2002 requires that companies certified to that standard require their suppliers to be 3rd party certified to ISO 9001:2000 at a minimum (with a goal of compliance to TS 16949).

With the release of Chryslers Customer Specifics in September of last year, or possibly sooner, has the requirement for tier 2,3,4 suppliers changed? We recently had an external auditor tell us that from 4.1.5 of the Chrysler Requirements, all suppliers to US, have to be TS certified.

Some people internally don't interpret it that way.

Any discussion?

[Jim Wynne]

Originally Posted by xfngrs

With the release of Chryslers Customer Specifics in September of last year, or possibly sooner, has the requirement for tier 2,3,4 suppliers changed? We recently had an external auditor tell us that from 4.1.5 of the Chrysler Requirements, all suppliers to US, have to be TS certified.

Some people internally don't interpret it that way.

Any discussion?

It would be helpful if you could quote the part of the Chrysler requirements in question. It seems that you're saying that your auditor interpreted the requirement differently than your company interprets it, so it would be good to see the requirement.

[xfngrs]

I wasn't sure if it was "legal" to quote it. Here goes:

4.1.5 Supplier Quality Management System Development (ISO/TS 16949
cl. 7.4.1.2)
Assessment by an OEM or an OEM approved second party will be recognized as meeting the supplier compliance requirements to cl. 7.4.1.2. The organization must be certified by an accredited certification body to the current version of the ISO/TS 16949.

Supplier Development of Small Suppliers
When a supplier (subcontractor) to an organization is so small as to not have adequate resources to develop a system according to ISO/TS 16949:2002 or ISO 9001:2000, the organization shall have decision criteria for designating "small suppliers'. Such decision criteria shall be in writing,
applied consistently in the application of this provision, and verified by the 3rd party auditor.

Small suppliers shall be developed in accordance with 7.4.1.2 of ISO/TS 16949:2002, but can use 2nd party audits (as described below in this section).

NOTE: "Small" may also refer to relative volume supplied to automotive.

Second Party Chrysler Approval Guidelines
1. The 2nd Party must be ISO/TS 16949 registered.
2. The 2nd Party cannot be on TS Probation.
3. The 2nd Party must utilize a qualified Lead Auditor, or qualified Internal Auditor with evidence of successful completion of training, such as AIAG "Internal Auditing for ISO/TS 16949:2002".
4. The 2nd Party must audit annually each qualifying supplier for whom it has performed the 2nd Party service, and maintain records of these audits.
5. The duration of these audits must conform to the full application of the Audit Day Requirements table of the “Automotive Certification Scheme for ISO/TS 16949:2002”.
6. Any of the ISO/TS 16949:2002 accredited Registrars (Certification Bodies) may be utilized as an OEM-approved 2nd Party.

4.2 Chrysler - Specific Requirements
4.2.1 Third-Party Registration Requirements
All Production and Service Part organizations to Chrysler shall be Third-Party Registered to ISO/TS 16949 Second Edition.

Thanks for your interest.

[Jim Wynne]

Originally Posted by xfngrs

I wasn't sure if it was "legal" to quote it. Here goes:

4.1.5 Supplier Quality Management System Development (ISO/TS 16949
cl. 7.4.1.2)
Assessment by an OEM or an OEM approved second party will be recognized as meeting the supplier compliance requirements to cl. 7.4.1.2. The organization must be certified by an accredited certification body to the current version of the ISO/TS 16949.

Supplier Development of Small Suppliers
When a supplier (subcontractor) to an organization is so small as to not have adequate resources to develop a system according to ISO/TS 16949:2002 or ISO 9001:2000, the organization shall have decision criteria for designating "small suppliers'. Such decision criteria shall be in writing,
applied consistently in the application of this provision, and verified by the 3rd party auditor.

Small suppliers shall be developed in accordance with 7.4.1.2 of ISO/TS 16949:2002, but can use 2nd party audits (as described below in this section).

NOTE: "Small" may also refer to relative volume supplied to automotive.

Second Party Chrysler Approval Guidelines
1. The 2nd Party must be ISO/TS 16949 registered.
2. The 2nd Party cannot be on TS Probation.
3. The 2nd Party must utilize a qualified Lead Auditor, or qualified Internal Auditor with evidence of successful completion of training, such as AIAG "Internal Auditing for ISO/TS 16949:2002".
4. The 2nd Party must audit annually each qualifying supplier for whom it has performed the 2nd Party service, and maintain records of these audits.
5. The duration of these audits must conform to the full application of the Audit Day Requirements table of the “Automotive Certification Scheme for ISO/TS 16949:2002”.
6. Any of the ISO/TS 16949:2002 accredited Registrars (Certification Bodies) may be utilized as an OEM-approved 2nd Party.

4.2 Chrysler - Specific Requirements
4.2.1 Third-Party Registration Requirements
All Production and Service Part organizations to Chrysler shall be Third-Party Registered to ISO/TS 16949 Second Edition.

Thanks for your interest.

Thanks. There's generally no issue with quoting excerpts of copyright documents for our purposes; it's considered fair use.

7.4.1.2 doesn't prescribe 16949 registration of suppliers, but says;

The organization shall perform supplier quality management system development with the goal of supplier conformity with this technical specification

Emphasis added. "Conformity" is not the same as "registration" or "certification," so no requirement there. The way I read the Chrysler requirements, what's being required is that the conformity of suppliers to 16949 has to proceed under the conditions outlined:

Assessment by an OEM or an OEM approved second party will be recognized as meeting the supplier compliance requirements to cl. 7.4.1.2. The organization must be certified by an accredited certification body to the current version of the ISO/TS 16949.

This is where the confusion lies, I think. Your auditor might think that "the organization" as specified refers to the supplier. It doesn't.--it says that for a second-party (your company) to be qualified to assess the conformity of a supplier, the second party must be "certified...to the current version of the ISO/TS 16949," along with the other specified requirements (use of a certified lead auditor, e.g.).

[xfngrs]

That is what some people in our company have been saying. Thanks for your input.