Do you see an improvement in training since ISO9001:2000?

[Cathy]

I am looking at how ISO9001:2000 has changed company's training pogrammes and polices.

In my company there has been no visable improvement in the product. The system we have is good and works quite well. we evalute training and plan training needs against business development and ensure all staff are competent in what they do.

The staff are happy.....but they were happy anyway! The other management are annoyed about the amount of extra work in assessment of competence and evalution of effectiveness and we have a low rate of product returns and that has stayed the same.

Was it better to ensure that you had trained an employee and leave it at that rather than now use up time by continually monitoring them and deciding how competent they are when the basic skills don't change much?

Has anyone see significant improvements in training?

[RCBeyette]

Originally Posted by Cathy

I am looking at how ISO9001:2000 has changed company's training pogrammes and polices.

In my company there has been no visable improvement in the product. The system we have is good and works quite well. we evalute training and plan training needs against business development and ensure all staff are competent in what they do.

The staff are happy.....but they were happy anyway! The other management are annoyed about the amount of extra work in assessment of competence and evalution of effectiveness and we have a low rate of product returns and that has stayed the same.

Was it better to ensure that you had trained an employee and leave it at that rather than now use up time by continually monitoring them and deciding how competent they are when the basic skills don't change much?

Has anyone see significant improvements in training?

Hi, Cathy!

The topic of training and evaluating competency has been discussed before in the Forum. Do a search and I'm sure you'll get a bunch of great leads.

But to give you some food for thought...did you never monitor people before? Performance Appraisals/Evaluations are a simple tool that many companies employ to demonstrate not only comptency but that action is being taken if a lack of comptency is found.

You low rate of product returns are a good start, but not every Customer complains.

Training is just the start.

Here's an example...I have my driver's license, thus I am a qualified driver (I have been "trained" and meet the '94 Standard's requirements). But you do not know how many accidents I have been in or how many speeding infractions I have had (good numbers to demonstrate my "comptency" and meet the '00 Standard's requirements).

We use tools such as:

• Performance Appraisals (salary)
• Job Observations (hourly)
• Employee Feedback Sessions (hourly)
• Key Indicators
• Training
• Nonconformance Reports
• Customer Complaints
• Internal Audits
• Etc.

When you think about it, almost any tool within your Management System could probably be used to help establish your competency evaluation process.

[Cathy]

HI RCB,

I get what you are saying and we have done all that and record all that and evaluate competency. I have searched the forums for this topic and I haven't seen one that relates to the effect of training on the whole business and not just the effect of the std within the training area!.

What I mean is there is no signifcant improvement to our product or the business since we upgraded to ISO9001:2000. We did have fully training staff making the products and we still do.

A lot of man hours went into the training system and we have great records and can demonstrate everyone's competency but we have not seen advantages of this in other areas of the business. What I am looking for is whether or not cove folk have been able to demonstrate say, a decrease in production cost, a rise in sales, recommendations from a customer,increased efficiency, etc, because they have improved the training system!

Everything within the training system is compliant and works well. We spend more time than ever on the training system and we are not seeing other business benifits because from it. That's why I asked the question was it worth it?

[gpainter]

No real change noted in training at the present time. Good question to ask again in January 2005.

[RCBeyette]

We did not change our training system when transitioning from '94 to '00. Did your organization do that, Cathy? If yes, why? I mean, a Gap Analysis would have shown you if you had any areas to address in training, awareness and competency. If you already had the tools in place, yes, I can understand the existing frustration at the apparent increase in (paper)work.

So, think of it as a Continual Improvement project. What can be done to decrease the perceived extra work, without losing your ability to meet the requirements? But be careful...don't remove portions of yoru training (program) because you think they're just extra work.

I sometimes think that our training programme is too regimented...but I do understand why. We can be a lazy lot sometimes, and being given deadlines and forms to complete exactly forces us to do our jobs properly and effectively.

And without this training, without this regimented program, I would not be surprised if quality started to slide.

You asked if there was any benefit to having such a detailed training system. Ask yourself this, instead...what are the possible consequences if we do not?