Simpified ISO 9001 Internal Audit Questions

[NAOTB]

As a new internal auditor I have found the internal audit forms are not broken down enough into plain English. If I really don't understand the substance of the question I don't believe I can draw the right response. Is there any "plain english" audit question check list out there.

[Rachel]

Originally Posted by NAOTB

As a new internal auditor I have found the internal audit forms are not broken down enough into plain English. If I really don't understand the substance of the question I don't believe I can draw the right response. Is there any "plain english" audit question check list out there.

Hi NAOTB,

I an the ISO coordinator/lead auditor for our facility, and I am strongly against pre-printed checklists of any kind. The whole process approach to auditing implies that you should be looking at the inputs to your process, as well as the outputs from your process, and all of the other things that go along with those basics: what are your measurables? how do you know you're doing things correctly? where do you fit in the organization? what do you do if this product/service is nonconforming?

The inputs and outputs change in a lot of ways - from something as complex as a process overhaul, to something as simple as a non-conforming piece being sent to your process - and I really don't think that one checklist can cut it. Ideally, you should be developing your own checklist before you audit - that should help solidify your understanding of the process that you're auditing, and it should also account for any changes or current concerns within the process/department. Plus - it gives you the flexibility to make up your own questions that capture the intent of the standard and your procedures, but are phrased in a way that doesn't leave everyone around you thinking .

Hope this helps...
Cheers,
-R.

[Rob Nix]

I agree with Rachel's caution against preprinted checklists.

However, we have discussed some alternative methods in other threads. For example, please review the attached links:

The 10 Essential ISO 9001:2000 Audit Questions

and from Craig Cochran:

*** DEAD LINK ReMOVED ***

[BadgerMan]

We used a Powerway software package when we were first starting out (with the 9001:1994 rev) and found the supporting explanations to be fairly helpful in developing an understanding of the requirements. However, you need to be careful (we weren't) that the pre-printed checklists don't become a set of blinders for your auditors.

[Claes Gefvenberg]

Welcome to the Cove NAOTB

Originally Posted by NAOTB

If I really don't understand the substance of the question I don't believe I can draw the right response.

That is of course entirely correct, and I wholeheartedly agree with Rachel's and Rob's views. You are better off putting the questions together yourself.

Still, Badgerman has a valid point too: There is nothing wrong with using good examples to give you an idea what to go for.

I want to ask you something: There are cases when rookie auditors happen to be the companys first and only internal auditor, and as a consequence do their first audits alone. That is not an ideal situation. I hope you're getting the opportunity to team up with a seasoned colleague for your first audits? That should get you on track with minimal hazzle.

And hey: Good luck

/Claes

[Claes Gefvenberg]

NAOTB,

Thanks for your message. I did two things. First of all I moved your question to this audit forum in the hope of getting more replys, and secondly I looked for some old threads I think could be of use. Have a look:

Internal Audit Checklist - Production Audit Checklist
The 10 Essential ISO 9001:2000 Audit Questions

Internal Audit Training - An Internal Audit Training Map
Seeking: Internal Audit Training Material - Practice Audits?
8.2.2 - Opinions please...

I also suggest a look in the Free files directory

/Claes

[carolk79]

Thanks you guys

Claes hit the nail on the head
I am an auditor for a small business that does not know a lot about ISO
I am the only auditor that has any training in the last year. All the internal auditor (which is really only one) had a two day class about 3 years ago. So I am pretty much all by myself in the whole auditing process. We resently had a surveillence audit and we took a minor on the internal audit process (go figure) I (with the help of a minor nonconformance) finally talked upper management into allowing me to have more internal auditors. But I am now trying to find help to effectively train these guys so they can be useful to me. I have read alot of the words of wisdom in this forem.

So thanks for helping even if you didn't know that you were doing it.

[Sam]

I agree pre-printed questions are not good. Also if you are auditing to TS2 they are not acceptable as audit documentation by your 3rd party auditor.
First, you should understand the process. This can be done by walking through the process using the "process definition" as a guide. Once you understand the process then you can ask questions. Your questions should be based on inputs, activities, outputs, linkages(from & to), support processes and previous audit results.