China is hiring, and young Americans are going

[john.b]

This is a general subject I'm quite familiar with since I now work in Bangkok, Thailand, and it comes up all the time on expat forums. For a foreigner it is hard to do anything but teach English in Asia unless you have a very specialized skill set that's in demand due to both visa restrictions and unfavorable pay differences (that parallel cost of living differences).

That said, I'm working in IT and I know other expats doing different kinds of work. One of the more interesting differences is just seeing what's going on outside the US, which on a personal level relates to how Americans are regarded (long story, that part). I started out in quality work as a QA manager but have since moved on to data center operations, but still do work with a 27001 (security) system and 20000 (IT service management), and business continuity and "green" developments come up. Now I'm up against seeing how well it can transfer back to the US, mainly since I don't want my young son to grow up here.

 

[Wes Bucey]

This is a general subject I'm quite familiar with since I now work in Bangkok, Thailand, and it comes up all the time on expat forums. For a foreigner it is hard to do anything but teach English in Asia unless you have a very specialized skill set that's in demand due to both visa restrictions and unfavorable pay differences (that parallel cost of living differences).

That said, I'm working in IT and I know other expats doing different kinds of work. One of the more interesting differences is just seeing what's going on outside the US, which on a personal level relates to how Americans are regarded (long story, that part). I started out in quality work as a QA manager but have since moved on to data center operations, but still do work with a 27001 (security) system and 20000 (IT service management), and business continuity and "green" developments come up. Now I'm up against seeing how well it can transfer back to the US, mainly since I don't want my young son to grow up here.

As an experienced person who has been in the situation of being an ex pat working in a foreign country, perhaps you can enlighten us on the "triggers" which induce an American citizen to seek and accept employment in a foreign country (especially if the wages are as disparate as you suggest.)

Like most consultants, I accept jobs anywhere my physical safety is not in peril, but, then, I know the job is finite and I will soon leave to another site or even home.

I used to suspect many folks went for the "glamor" or because they had some humanitarian reason. Lately, however, I've been aware of a number of American citizens who first went to work in a foreign country on behalf of an American company opening a branch or subsidiary in the foreign country, then being induced [seduced?] to work for a foreign company at a big bump in pay (essentially, the foreign company is buying skill and experience to get a running start in cracking the American market.)

I've begun to think this previous reasoning of mine is incorrect and that there are more valid and common reasons for ex pats working in foreign countries, especially in developing nations. I'm interested in learning some real reasons from folks who are living the experience.

 

[john.b]

Happy to converse, thanks. Of course the reasons are very mixed. Formerly the standard paradigm was what Wes mentioned: multi-national corporations would bring in foreigners at foreign wages (a small fortune here) to cover technical thin spots, and then perhaps those employees could move on to local companies again, at attractive wages. That practice is diminishing as development levels the skills availability, even with some substantial lagging in some areas matching development gaps.

I should probably clarify that if wages translate directly to far less than a first-world rates (according to currency exchange) but the cost of living is equivalently less than that real difference is a wash. Actual gains or losses are more likely, and given differences in lifestyle and relative difference in pricing the actual standard of living shift is not easy to equate. For example, fast food and Starbucks cost exactly the same, making them relatively much more expensive, so if other Western lifestyle elements are important then there is less experienced cost of living difference. Completely assimilating isn't as easy as it sounds but with lifestyles Westernizing what that means is complicated.

To switch to a personal account, I moved here because I married a Thai wife that attended grad school with me in the US and a scholarship knowledge-exchange clause denied her an American visa for two years. I thought there would have to be an escape clause but the scholarship essentially originated from the US State Department. I know of others that have relocated or else want to move to Asia because they've visited and like it here. In less developed places the humanitarian ideal driver makes more sense--a friend's family runs a school in rural Cambodia, related to that--but I live in Bangkok.

To be frank expats here can tend to be a slightly unconventional bunch because the circumstances that brought them here are often unusual ones, not always a bad thing.

 

[kekoukele]

welcome to beijing. beijing welcome you.
new beijing,great olympic.

 

[john.b]

One other interesting temporary job position I read of in relation to China: pretending to work in a company you really don't hold a normal position in, for PR purposes for special events. Token foreigners (generally Western, read: white) would be hired to pretend to be executive specialists.

But the Asian markets are maturing, just as Japan did in throughout the 70's, moving from copying Western technology to surpassing it. As I recall China now has the fastest high speed trains, based on earlier German technology that they now make themselves, and I just saw an article on how South Korea is upgrading internet infrastructure in spite of having the fastest internet in the world, already superior to the US.

 

[Wes Bucey]

One other interesting temporary job position I read of in relation to China: pretending to work in a company you really don't hold a normal position in, for PR purposes for special events. Token foreigners (generally Western, read: white) would be hired to pretend to be executive specialists.

This is a direct steal from a confidence game popular in the 50's, 60's, and 70's called "the Big Store" - it's still alive where the con artists want victims to think they are dealing with a big, legitimate business. The big store isn't the direct vehicle to take money, just a "front" to make the real con seem more legitimate. In the 70's, we had con artists coming out of the woodwork, some running big stores, who were trying to peddle bogus German bearer bonds and/or long-term contracts for millions of barrels of oil at below-market prices. Usually, the scam was just to get victims to part with up-front earnest money "binders" to seal the deal. One small Midwest oil refinery company actually put up a million dollars on one of the bogus oil deals. As you may guess, it is no longer in business, having been swallowed up by a smarter competitor.

But the Asian markets are maturing, just as Japan did in throughout the 70's, moving from copying Western technology to surpassing it. As I recall China now has the fastest high speed trains, based on earlier German technology that they now make themselves, and I just saw an article on how South Korea is upgrading internet infrastructure in spite of having the fastest internet in the world, already superior to the US.

I'm pretty sure a number of countries have faster average bandwidth speed than the US. I'm also pretty sure they aren't dealing with a lot of legacy infrastructure or a large field of competing companies and systems as the US is.

 

[john.b]

This last point relates to "leap-frogging", jumping ahead by skipping commitments to earlier technological steps. In my experience in Thailand it's not happening much--the third world really is generally behind on most fronts--but there are examples. In addition to internet example I vaguely recall reading that China is already ahead of the US in solar energy production.