ISO9001:2015 Clause 9.2 How to audit internal audits.

[Cats Clause]

Good feedback. Thanks all.

 

[qualitymanagerTT]

Naa, I want to see the output. Taking and passing a course just means one took and passed a course (that they probably didn't pay out of pocket for), competence is being able to actually do it, which many can't regardless of classroom hours.

Right on the money, as usual!

ISO 9000:2015 3.10.4
competence: "ability to apply knowledge and skills to achieve intended results"

 

[Sidney Vianna]

its the audit which is “independent” - that is done without “pressure”.

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[FRA 2 FDA]

Required or not, I don't see why you wouldn't WANT to audit the internal audit process. It's an important function of a business (if it's done right). Don't you want to make sure it's being done as stated and that there aren't any glaring holes in the process and maybe even see if there are any improvements that could be made? We just did an internal audit on our internal auditing process and we did it just the same way we do all our other internal audits.

 

[Randy]

Required or not, I don't see why you wouldn't WANT to audit the internal audit process

There's no WANT to it, it's an absolute requirement.

 

[qualitymanagerTT]

We just did an internal audit on our internal auditing process and we did it just the same way we do all our other internal audits.

I recently did an audit of a small (<20 employees) company where they outsourced their internal audits, and the same individual has been doing the internal audits for the past couple years (i.e., more than 2 audits).

How did you ensure impartiality of the audit process in selecting auditors to achieve independence?

 

[Quality-Nation]

How did you ensure impartiality of the audit process in selecting auditors to achieve independence?

Impartiality of audit process in selecting auditors? These are two separate and distinctly different things.

 

[FRA 2 FDA]

I recently did an audit of a small (<20 employees) company where they outsourced their internal audits, and the same individual has been doing the internal audits for the past couple years (i.e., more than 2 audits).

How did you ensure impartiality of the audit process in selecting auditors to achieve independence?

There really is no "selecting auditors" for us. We have only 3 of us in admin positions so we are all involved in every audit. In this case, I was the auditee as the internal audit process is under my ownership and the other two auditors/members of admin staff carried out the audit. We were lucky here because one of these people is fairly new and has participated in only two other audits so we were able to look at evidence from audits that occurred before he was here. In general, we can demonstrate impartiality as most of our audits have resulted in findings. Yes, we are small so we are all touching a lot of things and doing all of the audits not directly under our ownership, but we can show that we are in fact finding issues where they exist and none of the findings are bogus, over-reaching, or indicative of any maliciousness. I've seen many debates and discussions over the requirement of an auditor to be impartial or independent of the process and I think this meets the requirement. In all fairness and reality, we do recognize that we are an inexperienced group with an immature company and we really do welcome improvements so we in fact use our audits to help us discover where gaps are and fix them. No one is sweeping anything under the rug or out to get anyone.