Registrar Requesting Copies of Old Documents

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
Need input on how to handle a Registrar

Situation:

We just received a request from the 3rd party auditor for copies of the completed NCR (Non Conformance Reports) already issued back in 2011 because the registrar can not find the original document.

Note: We received a certificate for AS9100 Rev B and we have been upgraded to Rev C.

The company is informing the auditor that a fee for - finding, sorting, sending and administrative cost could be substantial.



Q. Is this reasonable for a company to request a fee for copies (already submitted to the registrar) from the registrar.

Q. How can a registrar certify a company without all of it's documents (reports, completed NCR etc).
 

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Leader
Admin
I have never heard of a registrar being charged for asking for documents. I will be interested to see the input for that. How much time will it take to retrieve a 2011 copy of nonconformance record(s)?

It is, however well within my imagination to ask for copies of documents; I work off of my own computer and keep records in files that could be lost of my computer fails and I don't have backups. However, I am supposed to submit these completed NC records to the registrar so I could ask the main office for records. I wonder if your auditor never submitted the completed NC records from 2011, or if he hasn't asked the registrar office?
 

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
I have never heard of a registrar being charged for asking for documents. I will be interested to see the input for that. How much time will it take to retrieve a 2011 copy of nonconformance record(s)?

It is, however well within my imagination to ask for copies of documents; I work off of my own computer and keep records in files that could be lost of my computer fails and I don't have backups. However, I am supposed to submit these completed NC records to the registrar so I could ask the main office for records. I wonder if your auditor never submitted the completed NC records from 2011, or if he hasn't asked the registrar office?

According to the company - all of the documents were submitted to the registrar - a certificate was produced - AS9100 rev B (the original auditor with records is not around any more) and now the same registrar wants copies of the NCR because the registrar has misplaced the original documents.

According to the company, they will have to look for the original files (QA Rep is no longer with company) and resubmit. - they are asking for a fee for such services since they met the original intent of the 2011 (18 months ago contract).

It looks like the registrar lost the documents and are being audited and wants the company to bail them out - the company is wondering if they should change registrar, move on and don't invest more time in procuring old records.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Leader
Admin
The company could change registrars, but interestingly both the company and the auditor seem to share the same difficulty in hanging onto records.
 

AndyN

Moved On
It sounds like the client doesn't 'think much' of the registrar! We all misplace stuff, and if the supplier were anyone else, and one we valued, we'd help them out - wouldn't we? So, to suggest charging the CB for the work to retrieve copies and send them sounds to me like something less that a "mutually beneficial supplier relationship".

Maybe an evaluation of that relationship should be done with a view to a transfer - especially if the total picture of dealing with them isn't so good...
 

Big Jim

Admin
The registrar is not at all out of line. The registrant is required to maintain records and those records need to be retrievable. No matter what the reason for asking, the registrar has a right to obtain them.

I don't know how or where you and your registrar got into such a sour relationship that you would even think of charging for producing the records. This is a strong indication that your company isn't really with the program, just doing what they minimally need to get by. If that is the attitude, you won't find it much different with another registrar.
 

AndyN

Moved On
You are quite correct, Jim. The registrant IS required to maintain records - typically for 3 years to enable continuing registration. But I don't think the purpose was to 'back up' the CBs mishandling of records...
 

AndyN

Moved On
It doesn't matter what the reason for the need is.

Oh, but I do think it does! Isn't there an accreditation requirement (which may be based on ISO 9001) to "maintain records"? Clearly, the CB didn't - and we don't know the real reason - but surely it DOES matter what the reason is! The client has to do it, and NOT as a back up for the CB!
 

somashekar

Leader
Admin
Q. Is this reasonable for a company to request a fee for copies (already submitted to the registrar) from the registrar.
No, It is not reasonable. I am not from the AS9100 QMS, but my thinking tells me that you must honor this request and make the relationship with the CB as smooth as can be. What if your next internal auditor asks for this ? Will you be able to retrieve it within reasonable time, or end up saying LOST ... ??

Q. How can a registrar certify a company without all of it's documents (reports, completed NCR etc).
Since you have submitted these you say, you are not certified without these being submitted.

There is no harm in asking the CB why they need it again, and no harm in mentioning that you are re-sending this upon request of CB.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom