Red Metric on a Customer Scorecard is a Major Nonconformance

[tkevmoore]

My registrar auditor has repeated several times that if we have a red metric on a customer scorecard he is required to write a Major Non-compliance. He has only written up as a Minor when he's found them since we have objective evidence that our CAPAs appear to be effective, but I'd still like to find source of this requirement. Any help? Thanks.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Very likely the source of this requirement is the gray matter inside your auditor's skull, if you catch my drift.

There is no such requirement in AS9101, AS9104/1, etc. So, the auditor can only be mentally fabricating this, as I don't believe any CB would unilaterally impose such nonsense. You should, as always, ask your auditor to identify the source.

 

[kgott]

My registrar auditor has repeated several times that if we have a red metric on a customer scorecard he is required to write a Major Non-compliance. He has only written up as a Minor when he's found them since we have objective evidence that our CAPAs appear to be effective, but I'd still like to find source of this requirement. Any help? Thanks.

If one of your own documents says something to this effect then perhaps he's holding you accountable to your own requirements in which case he may have a case. If this is not the case then I would certinaly be asking where he is comoing from with a finding like that.

 

[Joy]

Can you please post the nonconformity statement and clause number the auditor has referred?

 

[Mikishots]

If one of your own documents says something to this effect then perhaps he's holding you accountable to your own requirements in which case he may have a case. If this is not the case then I would certinaly be asking where he is comoing from with a finding like that.

If this is the case, it clearly falls in the lap of a minor (defined as a single system failure or lapse in conformance with a procedure associated to the organization's quality management system).

There is no way that something like this could ever be a major nonconformance: There is no absence or total breakdown of a system, it doesn't result in the likelihood of delivering nonconforming product, it won't result in the failure or reduce the usability of a product...it just doesn't make sense.

 

[dsanabria]

If this is the case, it clearly falls in the lap of a minor (defined as a single system failure or lapse in conformance with a procedure associated to the organization's quality management system).

There is no way that something like this could ever be a major nonconformance: There is no absence or total breakdown of a system, it doesn't result in the likelihood of delivering nonconforming product, it won't result in the failure or reduce the usability of a product...it just doesn't make sense.

Thank You for the definition of a minor NCR but that is not a clause and I agree - the auditor just made up his own rules.

Unless there is evidence that is not available to us I would challenge this NCR by the auditor.

 

[Mikishots]

Thank You for the definition of a minor NCR but that is not a clause and I agree - the auditor just made up his own rules.

Unless there is evidence that is not available to us I would challenge this NCR by the auditor.

Not sure I understand what you're saying. It certainly IS a clause, detailed in AS9101D 3.3.

 

[tkevmoore]

Thanks for the feedback. I agree this should not be an NC, especially since there is nothing in our documentation that identifies this as a trigger for a formal corrective action (although maybe it should). Anyway, since he hasn't brought this issue up again my boss wants me to hold my ammo in check. But I'll be ready if he brings it up in our closing meeting Friday!

Thanks again for being a great sounding board

 

[dsanabria]

Not sure I understand what you're saying. It certainly IS a clause, detailed in AS9101D 3.3.

What you have described is the definition of a minor non conformance in AS9101D.

3rd Party auditors can only issue an NCR against AS9100 Rev C.

The auditor in this case has created an NCR that is not supported by AS 9100 Rev C.

 

[clara]

Hi everybody,
Hope all of you are going on well.
In my opinion, auditor can raise a NC if you did not implement any action to eliminate this detected nonconformity as required by 8.3 a) of AS9100 Rev C or when there is not any new action that is specified when the taken corrective action is not timely and effective as planned.
Regards.