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Where should the Process Failure Form reside?

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  Post Number #1  
Old 10th March 2004, 02:25 PM
little__cee

 
 
Total Posts: n/a
Question Where should the Process Failure Form reside?

I was not sure whether to post this Documentation and Forms, Nonconformance and Corrective Action Systems, or Preventive Action and Continuous Improvement!!! Please feel free to move it accordingly!

We have a Process Failure Form. This form can be filled out by anyone in the organization and gets reported on in the form of Pareto Charts in our monthly Joint Supervisors Meeting. When a Process Failure Form (PFF) involves an external failure, it is mandatory for a Corrective Action (CA) to be filled out.

Now -- my question - what to do with the forms? Who keeps them? Right now, the way things work is that if the PFF becomes a CA, it gets stapled to the CA. I have no problem with that.

But if the PFF is internal, it gets reported on in the meeting, and then everyone has his/her own way of storing, filing, or discarding the forms. They are supposed to be to collect data and I've heard the argument that once the data has been recorded on the Pareto Chart - that's it - Sayonara and welcome to the Round File (aka File 13, The Trash Can, etc)

Do other people have some sort of central filing location or storage for similar forms? Or is the Round File the disposal method of choice?

Our Corrective Action procedure is no help on this one - I'm on my own here and just wanted a consensus as to what other people do. Thank you.

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  Post Number #2  
Old 10th March 2004, 05:25 PM
Bridget's Avatar
Bridget

 
 
Total Posts: 97
Do what you want prefer!

Hi,
Sounds like too many people in your company want to be chief. You should file the form within the procedure where you reference the form. If it is your responsibility to maintain your quality records list and you have the space I would keep them, filed by date or subject, for as long as I could. Secondly you could create a database and just enter the important data into it for storage and then dispose of the forms. We had a similar form in the past, discontinued using it and I still have them, you never know when a new manager comes aboard and wants background data. Of course I am lucky, I have plenty of storage space.
Good luck in your decision.
Bridget

Last edited by Bridget; 10th March 2004 at 05:28 PM.
  Post Number #3  
Old 10th March 2004, 05:38 PM
db's Avatar
db

 
 
Total Posts: 2,590
Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Bridget

Hi,
Sounds like too many people in your company want to be chief. You should file the form within the procedure where you reference the form. If it is your responsibility to maintain your quality records list and you have the space I would keep them, filed by date or subject, for as long as I could. Secondly you could create a database and just enter the important data into it for storage and then dispose of the forms. We had a similar form in the past, discontinued using it and I still have them, you never know when a new manager comes aboard and wants background data. Of course I am lucky, I have plenty of storage space.
Good luck in your decision.
Bridget
Hey there Bridget! Welcome to the Cove!

Good post. It might be a good idea for a central repository for the internal forms. It allows for future review. However, if the only use is to provide information for the monthly meeting, then once the data is captured there, why would you want to keep the forms? As Bridget pointed out, it is your decision, and perhaps because there are no "rules" established for the form, everyone is doing their own thing with them. I would recommend determining a set of rules (at the meeting), then following the rules accordingly. One thing to remember is the decision might be to not do anything. I'm not sure that would be a problem either.
  Post Number #4  
Old 11th March 2004, 08:04 AM
RoxaneB's Avatar
RoxaneB

 
 
Total Posts: 3,016
Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by little__cee

Now -- my question - what to do with the forms? Who keeps them? Right now, the way things work is that if the PFF becomes a CA, it gets stapled to the CA. I have no problem with that.

But if the PFF is internal, it gets reported on in the meeting, and then everyone has his/her own way of storing, filing, or discarding the forms. They are supposed to be to collect data and I've heard the argument that once the data has been recorded on the Pareto Chart - that's it - Sayonara and welcome to the Round File (aka File 13, The Trash Can, etc)

Do other people have some sort of central filing location or storage for similar forms? Or is the Round File the disposal method of choice?
Electronic is the way to go at my organization. Our forms that have different names than yours, but serve similiar purposes, are filed electronically...on a directory where all can access them. Hard copies are retained for a desginated period in a centralized location.

All record locations, record holders, record retention times are stated on our, you guessed it, Records Master List.
  Post Number #5  
Old 11th March 2004, 09:59 AM
David Hartman's Avatar
David Hartman

 
 
Total Posts: 564
Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by little__cee

I was not sure whether to post this Documentation and Forms, Nonconformance and Corrective Action Systems, or Preventive Action and Continuous Improvement!!! Please feel free to move it accordingly!

We have a Process Failure Form. This form can be filled out by anyone in the organization and gets reported on in the form of Pareto Charts in our monthly Joint Supervisors Meeting. When a Process Failure Form (PFF) involves an external failure, it is mandatory for a Corrective Action (CA) to be filled out.

Now -- my question - what to do with the forms? Who keeps them? Right now, the way things work is that if the PFF becomes a CA, it gets stapled to the CA. I have no problem with that.

But if the PFF is internal, it gets reported on in the meeting, and then everyone has his/her own way of storing, filing, or discarding the forms. They are supposed to be to collect data and I've heard the argument that once the data has been recorded on the Pareto Chart - that's it - Sayonara and welcome to the Round File (aka File 13, The Trash Can, etc)

Do other people have some sort of central filing location or storage for similar forms? Or is the Round File the disposal method of choice?

Our Corrective Action procedure is no help on this one - I'm on my own here and just wanted a consensus as to what other people do. Thank you.
I afraid that I don't have an answer to your query, but I do have a question of my own. Why control multiple forms for reporting nonconformity? Why not use one form for reporting any type of nonconformity (especially since the data is being put into a database where sorting and analysis can take place)?

Just curious.
  Post Number #6  
Old 11th March 2004, 10:02 AM
David Hartman's Avatar
David Hartman

 
 
Total Posts: 564
Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Bridget

Hi,
Sounds like too many people in your company want to be chief. You should file the form within the procedure where you reference the form. If it is your responsibility to maintain your quality records list and you have the space I would keep them, filed by date or subject, for as long as I could. Secondly you could create a database and just enter the important data into it for storage and then dispose of the forms. We had a similar form in the past, discontinued using it and I still have them, you never know when a new manager comes aboard and wants background data. Of course I am lucky, I have plenty of storage space.
Good luck in your decision.
Bridget
Welcome to the Cove, Bridget. It's always good to welcome another Hoosier. What part of Central Indiana (N, S, E, or W of Indy)?
  Post Number #7  
Old 11th March 2004, 10:25 AM
little__cee

 
 
Total Posts: n/a
More information

I've learned a little more since the time of my post! It seems that several managers feel that not ALL process failure forms get reported on at our monthly meeting and they have sneaky suspicions that issues are disappearing.

The central filing idea has the appeal of being a double check -- 14 errors get turned in at monthly meeting, 20 are in the drawer...you get the picture. I didn't realize that angle of the query but now I know...

To answer the question of why there are multiple forms to report nonconformity...I really do not have a good answer. I was told to think of it in terms that the process failure form can be used for ANYTHING whether or not it needs an investigation. The Corrective Action form was for external failures or for something that needed detailed investigation. You're right - its duplicating information at times but surprisingly no one has complained about that aspect of our system.

Thank you all for the good discussion and ideas.
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