The Cove Business Standards Discussion Forums
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
UL - Underwriters Laboratories - Health Sciences
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now
Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Business Systems and Standards Discussion Forums > >
Forum Username

Elsmar Cove Forum Visitor Notice(s)

Wooden Line

VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now


Monitor the Elsmar Forum
Sponsor Links




Courtesy Quick Links


Links Elsmar Cove visitors will find useful in the quest for knowledge and support:

Jennifer Kirley's
Conway Business Services


Howard's
International Quality Services


Marcelo Antunes'
SQR Consulting, and
Medical Devices Expert Forum


Bob Doering
Bob Doering's Blogs and,
Correct SPC - Precision Machining


Ajit Basrur
Claritas Consulting, LLC



International Standards Bodies - World Wide Standards Bodies

AIAG - Automotive Industry Action Group

ASQ - American Society for Quality

International Organization for Standardization - ISO Standards and Information

NIST's Engineering Statistics Handbook

IRCA - International Register of Certified Auditors

SAE - Society of Automotive Engineers

Quality Digest

IEST - Institute of Environmental Sciences and Technology


Some Related Topic Tags
audits and auditing, control plans, proprietary information, vda 6.3 - process audit
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rating: Thread Rating: 1 votes, 4.00 average. Display Modes
  Post Number #1  
Old 9th April 2018, 02:00 PM
jimmymustang06

 
 
Total Posts: 44
Please Help! VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

So, does everyone really include all process parameters on their control plans? We will not be doing this. We have 75% market share and we did not get that way by giving our competitors a leg up.. we have timing, temperatures and pressures that are proprietary. I can't believe a company would expect another to just give up all of their hard work..

This auditor is saying that we have to include all parameters on our control plans. She goes on the say that she does not need to "receive" the document, that she can audit it next time in person, BUT we are a commodity product supplier. Our quality documents are in families. I can't add something to one control plan for one customer and then not include that control plan in PPAPs to a bunch of customers.. wtf!?!

Sponsored Links
  Post Number #2  
Old 9th April 2018, 03:41 PM
Golfman25

 
 
Total Posts: 1,393
re: VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

Can you add the process parameter, but keep the values "secret?" Maybe refer to an internal document of some type for the actual value.
  Post Number #3  
Old 9th April 2018, 04:04 PM
Ninja's Avatar
Ninja

 
 
Total Posts: 972
re: VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by jimmymustang06 View Post

So, does everyone really include all process parameters on their control plans? We will not be doing this. We have 75% market share and we did not get that way by giving our competitors a leg up.. ...
Highlighted the key word as it pertains to trade secrets (in my experience).

If you use your control plan as part of your work flow, you may handle it one way.
If you use it to satisfy a customer requirement, you may go another.

We put some of the obvious parameters in the CP...but only by reference to other documents which were not for sharing ("Fire at temperature specified in Formula Document")...
Some we just left out of the CP altogether...for the same reason you want to.

No auditor ever saw a formula document...ever...processes, sure...trade secrets, nope.

This approach did, however, require the rest of the structure to be aligned to allow for it.
It is reasonable for an auditor to know that there is guidance for how to make something (there better be!).
It is reasonable to know what areas must be controlled and how they are controlled.
Seeing the nitty gritty about what it is controlled to...we never even got asked, and we would not have shown it if we did.
Show how you know what to control it to...yes (in a dummy document).
Show the actual trade secret? uh-uh

The NDA with the auditor is much lighter than the NDA for an employee...and far harder to prove breach. I was sometimes surprised we got away with it, likely since we were willing to show the process and controls of a non-secret product.

Thanks to Ninja for your informative Post and/or Attachment!
  Post Number #4  
Old 11th June 2018, 06:14 AM
Kiran Walimbe

 
 
Total Posts: 17
re: VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by jimmymustang06 View Post

So, does everyone really include all process parameters on their control plans? We will not be doing this. We have 75% market share and we did not get that way by giving our competitors a leg up.. we have timing, temperatures and pressures that are proprietary. I can't believe a company would expect another to just give up all of their hard work..

This auditor is saying that we have to include all parameters on our control plans. She goes on the say that she does not need to "receive" the document, that she can audit it next time in person, BUT we are a commodity product supplier. Our quality documents are in families. I can't add something to one control plan for one customer and then not include that control plan in PPAPs to a bunch of customers.. wtf!?!
Dear Jimmymustang06,
Pl. Realize that your auditor needs to audit your processes as per the guidelines of VDA 6.3. One of the audit point needing answer and rating based upon the findings is ‘Are the requirements of the control plan complete and have they been effectively implemented? – P6.2.1.’ If the auditor cannot verify conformance, he/she has no option to give a Zero rating, which in turn pulls down your score.
Moreover, VDA training inculcates a strict code of conduct amongst the certified auditors which ensures confidentiality. So, I guess, it is better to open up.
  Post Number #5  
Old 12th June 2018, 10:44 AM
Ninja's Avatar
Ninja

 
 
Total Posts: 972
Re: VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

Quote:
In Reply to Parent Post by Kiran Walimbe View Post

... which ensures confidentiality. So, I guess, it is better to open up.
Nothing has been invented yet that "ensures confidentiality" with humans yet.
an NDA or code of conduct is a desire written on a piece of paper.

Set barriers against breach, sure...but nothing can stop a human from blabbing other people's secrets...just watch the news.

I would only open up as far as absolutely necessary to achieve your goal.
...and I would make sure it was absolutely necessary, and not a human's desire.
  Post Number #6  
Old 14th June 2018, 12:50 AM
Kiran Walimbe

 
 
Total Posts: 17
Re: VDA audit, control plan - My hair is almost gone now

Thanks for sharing your views.
Reply

Lower Navigation Bar
Go Back   The Elsmar Cove Business Systems and Standards Discussion Forums > >

Bookmarks



Visitors Currently Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 Registered Visitors (Members) and 1 Unregistered Guest Visitors)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Forum Search
Display Modes Rate Thread Content
Rate Thread Content:

Forum Posting Settings
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Emoticons are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Discussion Threads
Discussion Thread Title Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post or Poll Vote
Chrysler required FMEA and Control Plan Document Audit Forms and Process Audit Check Quetico FMEA and Control Plans 6 24th October 2013 04:51 PM
TS 16949 Clause 7.5.1.1 - Audit Finding - Control Plan Requirements TJM42853 IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 11 2nd June 2011 10:34 AM
External Audit Non-Conformance - Control Plan and Inspection Issues sowmya IATF 16949 - Automotive Quality Systems Standard 1 1st January 2011 03:31 AM
Control Plan and Audit Registration - PPAP - Packing Instructions alexoigres APQP and PPAP 5 4th October 2010 12:34 PM
Audit Nonconformance - Not following Control Plan - How to answer Request for CA? LORIBROWN - 2006 Document Control Systems, Procedures, Forms and Templates 8 17th December 2005 07:36 AM



The time now is 08:29 PM. All times are GMT -4.
Your time zone can be changed in your UserCP --> Options.



Misc. Internal Links


NOTE: This forum uses "Cookies"