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Batman1977
The situation is that a supplier changed their manufacturing process but not their materials or end product to increase capacity. Is it necessary to submit and notify our customer of this suppiler's change?
Supplier changed their Manufacturing Process - Is a PPAP resubmission required?
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
changing the process would typically be a key that the PPAP requires resubmission, but that can kind of depend on the process. No help to you whatsoever, can you give us some detail?
changing the process would typically be a key that the PPAP requires resubmission, but that can kind of depend on the process. No help to you whatsoever, can you give us some detail?
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
Howdy Batman,
I'm not going to answer your question ('cause I don't know the details of "the law") and I'm interested in the other answers to follow.
What I will point out is that you remain responsible for the material you send, regardless of whether you re-PPAP or not. So whether or not you need to, or choose to, alert your customer...make sure that you consider the potential future affects on your company.
Consider: The parts stop working for your customer >> They come visit you to find out why >> They find that your supplier changed a process >> and that's what the root cause is >> and you knew about it but chose not to tell your customer >> what happens then?
As with most things, this is a risk/reward scenario (unless of course it's required to advise them in which case it is moot). Verify your confidence level...
A question to SteelMaiden: Changing the process is a key...but a vendor changing their process? Just looking to clarify for my own knowledge...
Howdy Batman,
I'm not going to answer your question ('cause I don't know the details of "the law") and I'm interested in the other answers to follow.
What I will point out is that you remain responsible for the material you send, regardless of whether you re-PPAP or not. So whether or not you need to, or choose to, alert your customer...make sure that you consider the potential future affects on your company.
Consider: The parts stop working for your customer >> They come visit you to find out why >> They find that your supplier changed a process >> and that's what the root cause is >> and you knew about it but chose not to tell your customer >> what happens then?
As with most things, this is a risk/reward scenario (unless of course it's required to advise them in which case it is moot). Verify your confidence level...
A question to SteelMaiden: Changing the process is a key...but a vendor changing their process? Just looking to clarify for my own knowledge...
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Batman1977
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
Our supplier improved their existing process to increase from 3,125 nuts per hour to 8,750 per hour with no change to the part produced and supplied reports to that effect.
Thanks for the feedback!
Our supplier improved their existing process to increase from 3,125 nuts per hour to 8,750 per hour with no change to the part produced and supplied reports to that effect.
Thanks for the feedback!
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
Was the speed/throughput a part of the original PPAP (as in we produce this part at XXX/hour)? How was the change acheived? I mean, there is a certain amount of time it is going to take to produce product, were these parts just hung up in some bottleneck? If the actual production process changed (vs "we changed the way we handle the material flow") then it might require a new PPAP.
Back in the day, when I was involved with automotive, I found the easiest way to make these decisions was to call my customer and ask what they wanted me to do. Yeah, I know, there can be drawbacks to that, but you gotta know your customers and what/how to best communicate with them.
Was the speed/throughput a part of the original PPAP (as in we produce this part at XXX/hour)? How was the change acheived? I mean, there is a certain amount of time it is going to take to produce product, were these parts just hung up in some bottleneck? If the actual production process changed (vs "we changed the way we handle the material flow") then it might require a new PPAP.
Back in the day, when I was involved with automotive, I found the easiest way to make these decisions was to call my customer and ask what they wanted me to do. Yeah, I know, there can be drawbacks to that, but you gotta know your customers and what/how to best communicate with them.
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
I've only done a couple PPAPs, but I would not have reported this as the PPAP did not flow down to my suppliers of components processes.
I've only done a couple PPAPs, but I would not have reported this as the PPAP did not flow down to my suppliers of components processes.
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Rand T
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
I have performed 100's of PPAP's, and I would say a resubmission is required unless you get a customer waiver.
I would call your SQE and ask if they want you to resubmit or not and react accordingly.
I have performed 100's of PPAP's, and I would say a resubmission is required unless you get a customer waiver.
I would call your SQE and ask if they want you to resubmit or not and react accordingly.
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asjahmed
Re: Is a PPAP resubmission required?
Batman1977, if you are in automotive parts manufacturing, you'd be well advised to at least contact your customer on this.
Batman1977, if you are in automotive parts manufacturing, you'd be well advised to at least contact your customer on this.
I've a question for you. The supplier has more than doubled his production. Didn't he ask for a price increase? If so, you are left with little option but to notify your Customer, unless otherwise your Organization can absorb the cost.
Check your Customer specific requirements or contract review and decide based on this.
If not, Ninja's is a practical view I would agree with. Check the risk level and if needs be notify your Customer. PPAP submission is the Customer call.
Check your Customer specific requirements or contract review and decide based on this.
If not, Ninja's is a practical view I would agree with. Check the risk level and if needs be notify your Customer. PPAP submission is the Customer call.
Refer to the PPAP Manual
Section 3 - Customer Notification and Submission Requirements.
3.1 Customer Notification
The organization shall notify the authorized customer representative of any planned changes to the design, process or site. Examples are indicated in the table below (see table 3.1).
NOTE:- Orgazitions are responsible to notify the authorized customer representative of all changes to the part design and/or the manufacturing process.
Upon notification and approval of the proposed change by the authorized customer representative, and after change implementation, PPAP submission is required unless otherwise specified.
For more details, you can also refer to the table for Examples of changes requiring notification and clarifications.
Hope this clears your doubt.
Minrah
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