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8D's for finished programs - Permanent corrective measures


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  Post Number #1  
Old 9th July 2002, 11:21 AM
Al Cohen

 
 
Total Posts: 13
Unhappy 8D's for finished programs - Permanent corrective measures

After a program/contract has finished, is it possible to complete a an 8D/7 step? What permanent corrective measures can be put into place if you do not supply that customer with any more product?

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  Post Number #2  
Old 9th July 2002, 11:43 AM
M Greenaway's Avatar
M Greenaway

 
 
Total Posts: 1,657
Al

If you dont supply any more product to the customer then the problem cannot re-occur. If you want to compile an 8D in case of new business then simply state the fact that no corrective action will be undertaken due to end of product life, or whatever the reason.
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  Post Number #3  
Old 9th July 2002, 01:36 PM
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D.Scott

 
 
Total Posts: 1,592
Another approach would be to apply what you have learned from the C/A to other processes / programs / contracts to ensure you don't have the same problem in another area.

Dave
  Post Number #4  
Old 9th July 2002, 01:42 PM
JodiB's Avatar
JodiB

 
 
Total Posts: 563
Am I misunderstanding?

Why can't the problem occur again Martin? Am I missing something here? Is the root cause so imbedded in that particular customer's requirements that it just goes away?

If it is a system problem, then it has to be dealt with. The corrective action is for the system, not the product, not the customer.

Al, could you give more detail?
  Post Number #5  
Old 10th July 2002, 03:54 AM
M Greenaway's Avatar
M Greenaway

 
 
Total Posts: 1,657
Your right Lucinda.

I was thinking strictly in terms of a specific product supplied to a specific customer where the customer is demanding an 8D report.

You are quite correct that any complaint should be investigated to root cause, and actions taken as necessary for the good of the company.

Sorry - just starting to get trapped into the mind set of my current employer, thanks for snapping me out of it !
  Post Number #6  
Old 10th July 2002, 09:35 AM
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JodiB

 
 
Total Posts: 563
Well, back into my mindset of 3rd party audit I have to wonder how an open 8D request could pass muster. Or is this back to the previously discussed question of whether a NCR can be closed without action...? I suppose that one could always close out the 8D by saying that no action would be taken.....!

Perhaps wrong place to mention this, but a good 3rd party auditor will be looking for a good reason for not taking action. S/he will question the robustness of the CAPA process if it looks like a company ducks issues simply out of convenience. To me, saying that the customer is no longer a customer so we don't have to respond to them with corrective action smells like convenience.
  Post Number #7  
Old 10th July 2002, 10:53 AM
M Greenaway's Avatar
M Greenaway

 
 
Total Posts: 1,657
I guess we have two issues.

Firstly identifying a problem, discovering root cause and then taking appropriate action on the system.

Secondly we have the need to satisfy the customers burning desire for a full 8D report on every single reported incidence of non-conforming product.

My repsonse was leaning towards consideration of the second issue above, i.e. the formal report back to the customer. If an assessor picked me up for not reporting back an 8D to a customer that I no longer had I would have to laugh.
  Post Number #8  
Old 10th July 2002, 10:57 AM
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Randy Stewart

 
 
Total Posts: 1,158
I agree Lucinda, the verbiage would have to tell me why it was closed without action. Show me that the company looked into it and why that decision was made. Even if it was "uneconomical" due to contract expiration I would look to ensure the problem didn't cross over other operations.
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