António Vieira said:
Dear Sidney
Everybody I know here, does that.
This works this way:
A company that I never heard about phones me, because their consultant gave them my name. They ask me if I can make there an internal audit.
No problem so far. I go there and audit them. I do it just by my self, the registrar I work for has nothing to do with this service.
Then if that company chooses that registrar for certification and the registrar asks me (normally by e-mail) if I can do their certification audit I must tell then I can’t because I made that previous audit there.
The rule is for auditing we must have no contact with the company during the 3 years before. Except for any training action we gave there that couldn’t be done in the previous year of the certification audit.
I don’t see any conflict of interest. I still could say “quem não deve não teme”. And this the same way the Registrar thinks. In my point of view, this is a completely clean process!
Everybody I know here, does that.
This works this way:
A company that I never heard about phones me, because their consultant gave them my name. They ask me if I can make there an internal audit.
No problem so far. I go there and audit them. I do it just by my self, the registrar I work for has nothing to do with this service.
Then if that company chooses that registrar for certification and the registrar asks me (normally by e-mail) if I can do their certification audit I must tell then I can’t because I made that previous audit there.
The rule is for auditing we must have no contact with the company during the 3 years before. Except for any training action we gave there that couldn’t be done in the previous year of the certification audit.
I don’t see any conflict of interest. I still could say “quem não deve não teme”. And this the same way the Registrar thinks. In my point of view, this is a completely clean process!
Thank you for the candid response. This happens ALL over the World. People that subcontract with Certification Bodies many times also work as consultants and “internal auditors”. We have several Covers that multi task like that. Actually, working all these angles give these people an accelerated learning experience, imo. Nothing wrong there.
But, the reason for my question is that the IAF Guidance Document to ISO Guide 62 states:
G.2.1.34. The certification/registration body should be independent from the body or bodies (including any individuals) which provide the internal audit of the organization’s quality management system subject to certification/registration.
Also, if Registrars that use contracted auditors started telling them that they could not perform internal audits for companies certified by that registrar, that could be considered “restriction of trade”, a serious concern in the US.
First, I would like to know what the Accreditation Bodies understand of the paragraph above, and second, I would like to know how they police it. Because a requirement that is not enforceable is useless.