7.1.5.1.1 MSA for inline dimension vision inspection equipment

batteryguy

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#1
Our plant is highly automated, and we have vision systems that make dimensional judgements at various stages of our process. Would calibration records and equipment specifications suffice to cover the MSA requirements for these vision systems? The calibration frequencies and requirements are listed in our control plan, which is be approved by our customers through PSW's.
 
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Miner

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#2
Calibration alone will typically not be sufficient to satisfy the requirement. At a minimum, you will probably need to perform a Repeatability study assuming there is no human component (i.e., Reproducibility) to the measurements. Even automated measurement equipment will have Repeatability variation.
 
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batteryguy

Involved In Discussions
#3
Thanks Miner. If we have written customer approval to not perform MSA on this equipment would that be acceptable? The IATF clause states that records of customer acceptance of alternative methods shall be retained along with results from alternative measurement systems analysis.

For the record I agree with your assessment that repeatability studies would be best for this, but I'm getting some pushback about completing those studies.
 

Ninja

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#4
FWIW, I would want to know if my equipment was telling me "the truth", whether or not my customer cared... I take the couple hours and run the study rather than use those hours figuring out how to avoid it.

Not to very hard to do a repeatability study...likely more work to avoid it (defense paperwork) than to just do it...

That said, as long as you have documented approval from all customers whose products run on that line, you might be able to convince the auditor...

My two cents...
 

Miner

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Staff member
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#5
Thanks Miner. If we have written customer approval to not perform MSA on this equipment would that be acceptable? The IATF clause states that records of customer acceptance of alternative methods shall be retained along with results from alternative measurement systems analysis.

For the record I agree with your assessment that repeatability studies would be best for this, but I'm getting some pushback about completing those studies.
A repeatability study is pretty standard and should not be called into question by an auditor (no guarantees though). Alternative measurement systems analysis would include such approaches as Wheeler's Honest Gage Study, methods that deal with Within Part Variation, etc.
 

stevegyro

Involved In Discussions
#6
Thanks Miner. If we have written customer approval to not perform MSA on this equipment would that be acceptable? The IATF clause states that records of customer acceptance of alternative methods shall be retained along with results from alternative measurement systems analysis.

For the record I agree with your assessment that repeatability studies would be best for this, but I'm getting some pushback about completing those studies.


Sad to hear that “pushback” word.
As quality professionals, I sick and tired of managers who hire QE’s, and then have no problem ignoring their recommendation.

Sorry I’m this sensitive, but I have had the same, for aerospace (jet engine parts). Managers like that should face a jury some day.

Best wishes!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
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