7.2.2 - Confirming Order if the product requirements are not provided in writing?

[Douglas E. Purdy]

What is meant by the organization having to confirm the order if the product requirements are not provided in writing?

Thanks,
Doug

 

[Wes Bucey]

In many companies, including mine, we make a written memorandum of the verbal confirmation (very frequent occurrence in "redlining" changes during a prototype installation when every minute an airplane is on the ground costs someone big bucks.) Copy of the memorandum is sent at later date (hours or days later) to the person making the verbal confirmation and copy is placed in product/project file. Other copies may be distributed as needed.

Ultimately, someone responsible signs off on the changes.
We once did a million dollar installation on a verbal. The guy issuing the verbal subsequently died of a stroke. The successor signed off without blinking an eye.

It is "nice to have" when a customer issues a nice, perfect purchase order which is then examined by a multi-discipline team as part of Contract Review before acceptance. Many times, though, the pressure of business requires telescoping the timetable for procedures. It does not, however, remove the requirement for maintaining a record of some kind, even a unilateral one.

Consider buying groceries at your local supermarket. Do you issue a purchase order? Probably not, but the store issues a unilateral receipt for your money, listing the products you purchased. It also keeps a record of the transaction for future reference. Is any manufacturing or service concern less capable than a grocery store?

 

[Claes Gefvenberg]

What is meant by the organization having to confirm the order if the product requirements are not provided in writing?

Thanks,
Doug

The customer ordering the "this or that". is usually not in the least interested in how you produce it. He just wants the product.

You, on the other hand are very interested in knowing that you are in fact able to produce it, right? So, if the customer provides insufficient information it's up to you to fill in the blanks, and get the confirmation within your organization as necessary: Yes, we can do this.

In it simplest form it may concern having a peek in your product programme and picking a std product. Some times it may involve starting a project...

/Claes

 

[db]

What is meant by the organization having to confirm the order if the product requirements are not provided in writing?

Thanks,
Doug

Think of it this way Doug, ISO is meant for any business. So you call my company (at 1-800 Jerky Me) and want to order 500 lbs of my finest buffalo jerky. The order is verbal (over the phone). It is my responsibility to make sure you wanted 500 lbs of jerky at $50 per pound. If I either heard it wrong or wrote it wrong, and you only wanted 5 lbs at $.50 per pound, there would be a lot of trouble. Therefore, I need to confirm the order. :thedeal:

BTW, I do not have a jerky business, and I have no idea what would happen should you dial the above number.

 

[SteelMaiden]

What is meant by the organization having to confirm the order if the product requirements are not provided in writing?

Thanks,
Doug

I can't add a whole lot, but, your confirmation needs only to meet the requirements of your business. Micky D's reads back your order at the drive thru. The grocery cashier asks if you found everything you needed. My company faxes an order acknowledgement.

 

[Douglas E. Purdy]

Wes, Claus, & db,

Thanks for your response. I ask because I did not see in the dictionary (Merriam-Webster Online) the concept that the information taken from the requester is to be sent to the requester for verification. With synonyms like substantiate, corroborate, verify, authenticate, does taking the verbal order over the phone by writing it down on your internal form and repeating the specifics back on the phone sufficient for 'confirmation.' To satisfy 7.2.2, do I have to send the order in writing back to the requestor for them to confirm or verify that I have written the order properly? Or is it sufficient to authenticate the verbal order by writing the specifics on an internal form and verbally confirm the information is correct over the phone, write the name of the requester as confirmed by?

Thanks!

 

[db]

To satisfy 7.2.2, do I have to send the order in writing back to the requestor for them to confirm or verify that I have written the order properly? Or is it sufficient to authenticate the verbal order by writing the specifics on an internal form and verbally confirm the information is correct over the phone, write the name of the requester as confirmed by?

All you have to do is to confirm them. Verbal confirmation over the phone during the order would be sufficient. Documentation of this confirmation is required to the extent that you can show records of the review and to ensure you are meeting the requirements.

 

[Claes Gefvenberg]

Um... Hang on a sec... Am I missing something or are we mixing 7.2.2 and 7.2.3 up here?

What 7.2.2 tells us is: Where the customer provides no documented statement of requirement, the customer requirements shall be confirmed by the organization before acceptance.

7.3.2b deals with ...effective arrangements for communicating with customers in relation to

b) enquiries, contracts or order handling, including amendments, and...


/Claes

 

[db]

Um... Hang on a sec... Am I missing something or are we mixing 7.2.2 and 7.2.3 up here?

What 7.2.2 tells us is: Where the customer provides no documented statement of requirement, the customer requirements shall be confirmed by the organization before acceptance.

7.3.2b deals with ...effective arrangements for communicating with customers in relation to

b) enquiries, contracts or order handling, including amendments, and...


/Claes

I was looking strictly at 7.2.2. Why do you ask?

 

[Douglas E. Purdy]

db,

Thanks! I read 7.2.2 as my action with an in-coming verbal, which would be different if I was the purchaser with an out-going verbal.

Clause,

No, I was not trying to confuse 7.2.3 with 7.2.2. I was only trying to obtain the understanding of 'confirm' from the person receiving a verbal, as oppose to 'confirm' to the person receiving a verbal.

I think!

Doug