AIAG's MSA Manual 3rd Edition - A Look at K Values - Auditor Questions

[infraray]

MSA 3rd Edition question

Hello,

I first want to say this is a great forum with a lot of helpful info. I appreciate the service!

The question I have is: We just went through our QS audit and the auditor was questioning what we knew about the K values. with regard to GR&R. In his questioning he asked us why they change in the 3rd edition. I had no reply. Of course he wasn't looking for trouble just trying to see if it made sense to anyone else.

I understand that the K values are based upon the 5.15 @ 99%/ d2. However in the 3rd edition it is now based upon a smaller area under the curve. (Can't remember the exact number right now.) So can anyone tell me what's the deal? It looks like they got a little lenient on us or maybe I am just missing something.

Thanks for any assistance anyone can give.

Keith

 

[Atul Khandekar]

Keith,

Welcome to the Cove.

Maybe this little FAQ fro AIAG will help?

 

[infraray]

Thanks for the assistance, however I am still not convinced with what AIAG is saying. If I put in the new(3rd) edition K values I will get a different GRR. I have verified my excel spreadsheet to the data in the MSA and everything is correct. If I change K values however I get a different GRR%. According to AIAG the K values cancel out. This doesn't appear to be the case. Hmmm...

 

[Andrews]

Are there many changes in the 3rd edition of MSA manual?Do we have to redo all the MSA conducted till now.Sorry Iam curious because I have not yet got the new edition with me.

 

[Atul Khandekar]

The third revision is said to be more than a 100 pages longer than the second one.

I don't really think you will have to redo the MSA studies you conducted in the past and I don't think bad gages will become good (or vice versa) with new calculations.

 

[a_amirahmadi - 2002]

MSA 3rd Edition

Does any one know where I can get a copy of MSA manual 3rd edition or differences bitween 2rd and 3rd edition?

 

[Atul Khandekar]

The AIAG Site:
http://209.186.190.204/publications/quality/msa3.html

 

[xfngrs]

Does anybody know of a training supplier for MSA other than AIAG? Manager thinks AIAG is too expensive.

 

[Al Dyer]

1-330-698-2000,

Ask for Lynn Dupyee