All Measurements taken with a Variable Gage have to be Recorded 100%

#1
I've not yet had time to complete a gap analysis for transition to IATF from TS - I am transitioning summer 2018.
Someone from management asked me today about a "rumor" they heard. The rumor was that any/all measurements taken with a variable gage have to be recorded 100% once we are under the IATF standard. I find this hard to believe, but can anyone at least guess what FACTS this confusion may have come from? TIA! :thanx:
 
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Peters

Quite Involved in Discussions
#2
If record is required.
If required - digits are needed.
If not required - no record and no problem.

9.1.1.1 Monitoring and measurement of manufacturing processes
d) records of actual measurement values and/or test results for variable data;
 
#4
When you are recording variable data, you are now required to record the actual value.
What is not acceptable is just a checkmark (yes we tested).
Ok that makes a little more sense I think, if I understand you correctly. It sounds like you're saying that wherever there are special characteristics or that otherwise require SPC using variable gages, we just can't have a sheet out there to record GO/NG - that we have to record actual result. I don't know how anyone could say they were doing SPC if all they did was record accept/reject, so actual readings is of course what we're already doing. What had people nervous was the thought that we had to start recording every variable measurement we do, regardless if special characteristic or otherwise required by customer. So does it apply like I'm saying here, or is it truly that every variable measurement has to be recorded?
 

Golfman25

Trusted Information Resource
#5
Ok that makes a little more sense I think, if I understand you correctly. It sounds like you're saying that wherever there are special characteristics or that otherwise require SPC using variable gages, we just can't have a sheet out there to record GO/NG - that we have to record actual result. I don't know how anyone could say they were doing SPC if all they did was record accept/reject, so actual readings is of course what we're already doing. What had people nervous was the thought that we had to start recording every variable measurement we do, regardless if special characteristic or otherwise required by customer. So does it apply like I'm saying here, or is it truly that every variable measurement has to be recorded?
According to the verbage, if you measure it you need to record the actual measured value. So it doesn't deal with only SPC. There may be non-spc measurements you take that need to be recorded. So if it's burdensome, you'll likely review everything to see if it makes sense to measure it any longer.
 
#6
We have just completed the IATF transition audit with 0 Majors and 8 minors. One of our minors was on this topic. We have gages that we zero to a master ( the master is the nominal spec) and the operator writes how far they are from zero which would be measuring to the tolerance. ex. 25.125 +-.125 spec, the operator would write +.023 or whatever value would be. The auditor finding was they had to write it as 25.148 not +.023. How does everyone else interpret this?
 

Golfman25

Trusted Information Resource
#7
We have just completed the IATF transition audit with 0 Majors and 8 minors. One of our minors was on this topic. We have gages that we zero to a master ( the master is the nominal spec) and the operator writes how far they are from zero which would be measuring to the tolerance. ex. 25.125 +-.125 spec, the operator would write +.023 or whatever value would be. The auditor finding was they had to write it as 25.148 not +.023. How does everyone else interpret this?
Your auditor sounds like a tool. You recorded the actual value. You didn't do the math. I would push back on that one. What BS. I think the requirement was to get away from ok, or check. Stuff like that. Good luck.
 

jfries2

Involved In Discussions
#9
We have a control plan requirement to measure a feature in 3-7 locations, and to record the maximum and minimum measurements. This is being performed and variable data is recorded for the min/max as required. An internal audit recorded a finding against IATF 9.1.1.1.d stating that since 3-7 measurements are required, they should all be recorded. We are debating this and probably splitting hairs, but 9.1.1.1.d does not state that all measurements must be recorded. Thoughts on this?
 

Sebastian

Trusted Information Resource
#10
ISO 9000:2015
3.8.10 Record - document stating results achieved or providing evidence of activities performed.
Auditor witnessing measurements is able to state conformity to monitoring requirements. Now. What about yesterday, last week when only records are available?
 
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