ANSI/AIHA Z10-2005 specific for Occupational Health and Safety Management System

Randy

Super Moderator
#11
Is this certification just a marketing ploy, or is top management really serious about having a robust system to improve the occupational health & safety performance of the organization?

This is always the question with any certification. Is it for real or is is to just punch a ticket?
 
Elsmar Forum Sponsor
#12
Hi !

It is a pity really to not understand there is no difference between “should” and “shall” in a volontary standard (a normative organization don't have legislative power to realy sau "shall" and be obeyed, "shall" is just a hope as "should")… A proof: our audits reveal every day nonsatisfied requirements of a "shall" standard in many companies. In a way ILO is more realistic while saying "should". Why a company preferring the ILO-OSH (standard “should”) for its qualities wouldn't then satisfy its "should" requirements? Perhaps Randy you don't understand*, but more and more of companies understand the ILO-OSH interest perfectly. And opposed to what you says it's as easy to audit any “should” as to audit “shall” OHSMS requirements.
* But as John Lennon was singing : "imagine"... these no should just shall... it's easy if you try... and you have exactly the same ILO-OSH requirements (as made by AFNOR with ILO blessing...). Myself I can imagine the reverse in connection with ANSI Z10 or BS 8800, without denaturing the interest of these models.

You said "OHSAS 18001 now refers to itself as a standard, not a specification, or document, as in the earlier edition". Yes. It's not a big difference for a company which chooses this standard. But you forget still and always to quote the true reference of this standard : BS OHSAS 18001. Curious on behalf of a standards specialist, but comprehensible from a BSI epresentative to avoid recalling that OHSAS is British (but not international even many companies in the world use it). "There were an additional 40+ other organizations from around the globe that worked on the contents that were not under the control or management of BSI"... Yes. But standards of really international organizations are representative of a greater number of members. In addition ISO (a really international organization) don't decide to create an ISO OHSMS stantard (because ILO-OSH) and its very next standard on the social responsibility (ISO 26000) quotes the ILO-OSH… (ILO, a other really international organization).

I don't have anything to sell and no commercial interest to defend, just some ideas, of a senior H&S officer experienced belonging to an international group, to share and confront with other people interested by occupational health & safety management in our compagnies :
- now there are several national standards OHSMS available, it is a fact.
- there is only one international OHSMS (produced by ILO ; often taken as reference by the national standards ), it is another fact (as the fact these is only one EMS standard for example).
- for me ILO-OSH and BS 8800 or ANSI/AIHA Z10 are better than BS OHSAS 18001, it is not a fact but it is my personal judgement and I am not alone to do it.
- choice of an OHSMS model depends on the top management in each company (and its internal specialists), because this kind of text is a internal voluntary act (i.e. not imposed by standardization organization or certification body or by other companies) contrary to legal obligations (imposed from outside).

Cordially Randy.

Post Scriptum : Sorry I don't understand what was the "duh" factor (please do you want explain to me ?)
 
#14
Hi again !

I agree with you Sidney, and I prefer no certification rather to risk a “alibi” certification (I know that is opposed to CB interests). The finality of a management system is certainly not the certification (certification is neither an element of the management system nor a requirement of the standards). It is perhaps why standards as ILO-OSH or ISO 26000 don't aim certification.

Thanks Stijloor about "duh" definition...

Good night (for me).


Post-Scriptum for Randy about your phrase "And oh yes, to cut Henria off before she goes completely nuts..." (6th October 2009, 08:54 AM) : I cannot really translate this formula to French, but I have impression that it's not very respectful towards me. I never use this kind of matter towards a Net-surfer because I think that we shall-should (!) sharing or confrontind ideas without attacking the person. I invite you to respect me as I respect you.
Information: I am a man (my name is Henri, but there is another "Henri" at elsmar.com then I added “a"…). Cordially nevertheless, because to discuss OHSMS interests me much.
 
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