API Q1 4.3.2.2 Personnel Competence for Internal Auditors

J

Jayyy

Starting to get Involved
Internal Audit Finding: No evidence that internal auditor competency was determined for 2020 internal audit. That's because no request for evidence was made. Questions: Regarding an internal auditor, does Q1 apply only to an auditor chosen from within our company, as it does to our other employees? If outsourced from a consulting firm, as we usually do, are the certificates of completion provided by the firm acceptable evidence? If asked to provide a statement regarding the competence of the firms auditor, is that evidence or my opinion? I lean towards the latter, it being my opinion that me certifying his competence is somewhat
"above my pay grade". Thanks, Jay.
 
T

Thee Bouyyy

Multiple Personalities
Hi @Jayyy ,

Yes, you have to follow API Q1 4.3.2.2 even if you are outsourcing from a consulting firm to perform Internal audit. You have to ask them for submitting their auditor certifications and have to store within your QMS. Their complation of Internal audit report is not sufficient to fulfill the requirement of 4.3.2.2.
 
J

Jayyy

Starting to get Involved
Was close to the same conclusion, their auditors have always furnished their own certs, which I kept on file. Didn't know better at the time, I do now. I had the evidence all the time, he didn't ask for it like he does all other documents. "What do I think of auditors behavior?" is an opinion of professionalism, not the same thing as a certificate of competency. Thanks, Thee Bouyyy!
 
lanley liao

lanley liao

Lingli Liao
HI,Jayyy,I agree with Thee. "Audits shall be performed by competent personnel independent of those who performed or directly supervised the activity being audited to ensure objective and impartiality of the audit process." specified in section 6.2.2.2 of API Spec Q1. Meanwhile, Section 4.3.2.2 states that "Personnel shall be competent based on the appropriate education, training, skills, and experience needed to meet product and customer requirements." so whether or not audit is performed internal or external(outsourced), you should keep the evidence related to personnel competent.
 
D

dakinuniversity

Registered
Thee Bouyyy said:
May be he has to complete his non-conformance quota and already decided to give you the NC in 4.3.2.2.

You can still challenge this to directly API.
Click to expand...
Mr.Thee Bouyyy
On what basis to challenge to the API?
I totally agree with Mr. lanley liao that internal audit shall be performed by competent personnel independent of those who performed or directly supervised the activity being audited to ensure objectivity and impartiality of the audit process.
You have to maintain the Personnel competency based on the appropriate education, training, skills, and experience. and evidence of Personnel competency shall be recorded.
 
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