AQP Format - Distributor with two ISO 9001 certified locations

[MarilynJ6354]

My company is a distributor with two ISO 9001 certified locations. A major customer is insisting one location "Develop an Advanced Quality Planning format to ensure documented design reviews with the customer, FMEA generation, control plans, and known capabilities for new parts and revisions."We don't design, we don't manufacture. Sometimes we cut and ship but that's about it. Any idea how we should address this?

 

[SteelWoman]

If you never actually intend to perform those activities and the customer understands that but just wants, as this sounds, to be able to say you have something in place in case it's ever needed, why not just draft a letter saying that while you currently perform no APQP activities if the need arises you would adhere to formats and processees as outlined in the AIAG manual, referencing the manual?

 

[MarilynJ6354]

AQPQ Format

We have actually done some FMEAs and PPAPs at other locations when required. We perform drawing review when we get them, although few and far between, and we use Six Sigma processes for things like process control, etc. Should I say we comply when required by the customer?

 

[SteelWoman]

Well, as a Tier 2 supplier (and even the percentage of our total business that is automotive is small) we probably don't do more than a handful of PPAPs each year. Our procedure says we'll do a ppap if requested to do so by the customer, and that when asked we will do one in conformance with the AIAG PPAP manual unless the customer specifies another format. How we handle this in practice is whenever a customer requests a ppap they FIRST get a form from us asking if the AIAG format is acceptable or if they prefer a different format. They have to sign off on that form before we even begin a PPAP. That way we have documented what they want and proceed accordingly.

It's pretty simple (as, obviously, am I! ), but it's worked for us.

 

[MarilynJ6354]

That sounds perfect. Thanks a lot!

 

[Howard Atkins]

I would like to clarify something,

MarilynJ6354 posted about reqirements for APQP for her company, whose product is as I understand it a service.

SteelWoman then started to talk about PPAP.

IMO the connection between the 2 is that PPAP is the output of stage 4 of APQP.
The request to perform Quality Planning is independent of PPAP

As I understand no matter what you do, you "manufacture" even if this is a service, this process needs to be developed and controlled by the use of tools such as Flow charts and FMEA (customers are requiring logistic FMEA's from traditional manufacturing companies, so here logistics is the product) and as a result a control plan- it exists as procedures and WI it is just a matter of changing the terminology as in general the CP is not part specific in distribution.
Capability of "products" are in fact your performance metrics, your "product" requirements are on time delivery, invoicing etc etc..

 

[Caster]

Try it you'll like it?

My company is a distributor with two ISO 9001 certified locations. A major customer is insisting one location "Develop an Advanced Quality Planning format to ensure documented design reviews with the customer, FMEA generation, control plans, and known capabilities for new parts and revisions."We don't design, we don't manufacture. Sometimes we cut and ship but that's about it. Any idea how we should address this?

Marilyn

I this is a good customer, you may need to comply. It becomes a business decision.

However, may I suggest you get a copy of the APQP manual from AIAG (if you don't have it already). Then go somewhere nice and order a beverage of your choice. Read through it and for each requirement sentence ask yourself "if we had a system to consider this issue, would we have prevented a problem?"

Jot down the problem that happened and a guess as to its cost. This should only take an hour or so.

Years ago we decided to get ISO certified. I argued for 9002 since we did not do design. My boss took forced us to develop an AQP system. It was actually based on the first draft of the APQP manual.

It was the best thing we ever did. Have a etter up front approach made us Millions of dollars!

You may not have to - but you may decide you want to!

All these ISO ideas came about due to real problems that hppen in real companies. It is the cheapest consulting advice available.

Good luck!

 

[MarilynJ6354]

This is our quality planning process...does it cover this issue?
Quality Planning and Objectives
QUALITY PLANNING
The ABC Company Quality System is the plan defining:
a. the quality objectives to be attained (e.g. characteristics or specifications, uniformity, effectiveness, aesthetics, cycle time, cost, natural resources, utilization, yield and dependability);
b. the steps in the processes that constitute the operating practice of the company;
c. the specific allocation of responsibilities, authority and resources during the different phases of the process;
d. the specific documented procedures and instructions to be applied;
e. suitable testing and inspection at appropriate stages
f. a documented procedure for changes and modifications;
g. a method for measuring the achievement of the quality objectives;
h. other actions necessary to meet the objectives.
Quality Management system planning is done to be consistent with section 4.1, the Quality Policy and Quality Objectives.
QUALITY OBJECTIVES
Quality objectives will be consistent with the Quality policy and established at appropriate levels. CTQs (Critical to Quality) will be defined in quantitative and measurable terms to meet product and customer needs. Appropriate personnel are made aware of the expected Quality objectives.

Examples of measurements may include, but not limited to:

· On time Delivery (SPAN)
· Customer satisfaction
· Internal and External failures
· Training

ADVANCED PRODUCT QUALITY PLANNING (APQP)
When required by a customer we will complete APQP processes that are applicable to our business. This may include Control Plans, PPAPs and FMEAs. If requested to do so by the customer, we will complete in conformance with the AIAG format unless the customer specifies another format. This is verified prior to beginning the process.

Printouts of this document may be out of date and should be considered uncontrolled. To accomplish work, the on-line document should be used.
Revision #: 3
Document ID: 3580

 

[Joe_winter]

yes, but which situation your quality planning has been developed in, as no design and mfg, do you think of it? of course, you as a distributor have to take many manners to guarantee your products made in all locations, which include documentation and inspectors. it is obvious that one quality objective of your company's is just to ask your factories to produce products to requirements of your customers, thus, a lot contolling documents are available and valuable to make your customers confidants. otherwise adversely need your customers to develop a set quality planning for your vendors, where are your responsibilities then? so, IMO it is very necessary and important for a distributor to provide enough apt documentation whenever required. do you think so?

Joe

 

[Caster]

Seems "lite" to me

This is our quality planning process...does it cover this issue?

ADVANCED PRODUCT QUALITY PLANNING (APQP)
When required by a customer we will complete APQP processes that are applicable to our business. This may include Control Plans, PPAPs and FMEAs. If requested to do so by the customer, we will complete in conformance with the AIAG format unless the customer specifies another format. This is verified prior to beginning the process.

It seems that you will follow the AIAG APQP manual for automotive customers unless instructed otherwise?

If there were no customer requirements - what would your AQP process look like?

What would you do if it only served to benefit your company?

If you approach it that way, it gets a lot easier. As it stands I bet your people see this AQP process as a non value added burden forced on them by Quality and the customer (ISO makes us do it).

If you can define a process that makes business sense for your comapny, you can then use the AIAG model as a gap analysis. Anything you don't cover could be added in if you think it will help, or left out since you know it doesn't apply.

This approach is a lot of hard work, but the benefit is improved designs that hit the shop floor in better shape and more ready to run.

If you do define your own process, audits become a walk in the park. You are doing it because you want to, and people follow the system beacause it makes sense to them.

Also, please look at the huge document Marc has concerning APQP on the main page of this site. Lot's of good ideas there.