AS9100 - Accountability for Job Travelers

Michael_M

Trusted Information Resource
#21
I have a question that will add-on to this question. We build parts and place them in a 'stock' location, our customers sends a signal to ship 'X' number of parts, we have 1-5 days to ship from this point depending on the customer. We stock raw material, that makes the parts, by the foot and usually run 12 foot bars.

However, this creates a different situation/concern. The 12 foot bars are random length (up to +/- 8 inches for the most part). So if we are running a 12 foot bar that is 8 inches long or short, and the part we are producing uses exactly 1 inch of material, we will have 8 piece short or over. We will not really know until we run the bar.

Manufactured parts are designated to 'stock' so we do not worry about making +/- percent.

How would you account for the extra/short parts produced since we will not 'know' the exact number until the bar is run and each 12 foot bar may produce a different number of parts?

P.S. We are a machine shop that makes piece parts to customer supplied drawings.
 
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H

HoppyRoo

#22
Hey guys,

Thanks again for all the input! Lots of great information.

After some discussion with the auditor, he's opted to downgrade the finding. :D

We are going to have to make a couple of adjustments, but it's all good.

-----------

Michael... we actually talked about similar situations. There are a few different ways to handle it. One option that might apply to your instance is simply to start the job with a guesstimate. After your initial run, just go back and adjust the job quantity with an "actual" once it's applicable. He said this would be perfectly acceptable.

I'll look at options that will best suit us and still be compliant to the standard, but again, I don't think it's anywhere near as drastic as he was making it out to.

:agree1:
 

suffelde

Involved In Discussions
#23
I hope I am understanding this right.
QMS Process ↔ Customer Order →Traveler Generated which requires a pull from raw material stock→machining/inspection process→put finished product into stock→pull for shipment.

If this flow is correct then one has to understand that you have raw material variation as an input to the process. One does not improve the process without removing the variation input. Thus, it becomes a CoPQ issue. Your QMS should address how to handle CoPQ issues including things such as acceptable $ thresholds, risks associated with, preventive actions, and continuous improvement. The left over material can have a blanket MRB disposition based on the above.

With respect to the traveler and traceability, a suggestion is to have the machinist log on the router the traceability of the raw material used along with the yield (count) for processes beyond. The left over remnants become an MRB/Inventory issue. Thus, you will be compliant with requirements.

In short, document your process - making sure you protect the internal and external customers; then do what you say you are doing.

Let me know if I didn't understand your process correctly.

Dave
 

dsanabria

Quite Involved in Discussions
#24
Haha...

I didn't say it was perfect. I agree, it's on the flaky side. ;)

That said, does this really warrant major nonconformance status?

Btw... thanks for your help guys. Your input makes this a lot more clear to me.
The auditor is actually correct!

But you are missing an excellent opportunity for improvement because of your energy being spent on proving the auditor wrong.

A lot of the small shops use the one piece setup piece through out the process and identified such piece in red color. This prevents the one red piece going to the customer and minimizes the scrap pieces. Furthermore, clear instructions at the beginning process to indicate that 3 pieces will be scraped due to set up pieces will also be part of the accountability process and minimize your documentation.
 
M

M.H.Ingle

#25
I have a question that will add-on to this question. We build parts and place them in a 'stock' location, our customers sends a signal to ship 'X' number of parts, we have 1-5 days to ship from this point depending on the customer. We stock raw material, that makes the parts, by the foot and usually run 12 foot bars.

However, this creates a different situation/concern. The 12 foot bars are random length (up to +/- 8 inches for the most part). So if we are running a 12 foot bar that is 8 inches long or short, and the part we are producing uses exactly 1 inch of material, we will have 8 piece short or over. We will not really know until we run the bar.

Manufactured parts are designated to 'stock' so we do not worry about making +/- percent.

How would you account for the extra/short parts produced since we will not 'know' the exact number until the bar is run and each 12 foot bar may produce a different number of parts?

P.S. We are a machine shop that makes piece parts to customer supplied drawings.
+/- 8" on a 12' bar is +/- 5% material.
I would not be worrying about what is going through the machine shop at this point, I would be worrying about consistency and conformity of material supply.
Material variations of this magnitude would be rejected at Goods Inwards for us. We run 3m or 1.5m bar lengths for most of our work and the variation we have in bar length is on the order of millimetres, or less than 1/2 a percent.
 
#26
I hate to bump a 5 year old thread, but this was the best thread in a quick search to go along with our possible finding.

We are a manufacturer that uses approximately 30 piece parts (many very small) in order to build an assembly. We attempt to run single piece flow so tracking quantity good/bad by process is not feasible as in some cases you only scrap some parts (when in a sub-assembly level) or because it would take longer to count than it would to actually complete the process.

We build in quantities close to 2500 and end up with ~2490 with a handful of piece parts due to weighing variation. There is little/no risk in tracking every single part/process. Why is it not feasible to wait until after final test and count the good/bad/scrap parts and assume the rest is piece part shortage if it is within X% of the normal MO size?
 
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