AS9100 Certification Audit Accounting for Additional Customer QMS Requirements

Buckeye44

Registered
To what extent do 3rd-party certification audits take into account customers' quality management system (QMS) requirements that exceed AS9100 requirements?

A government customer for a complex aerospace system contractually requires its prime contractors to maintain AS9100 certification and to be in conformity with many additional QMS requirements. Where AS9100 requirements describe only what to do, many of these customer requirements extend further into detailing how to do it. This government customer comprises 30-60 percent of the contractors' businesses, and the other customers (a mix of other government and commercial) only contractually require AS9100 certification.

AS9101F, Section 4.2.1 , Item i., requires audit planning to account for customer requirements. So please describe how auditors typically address 4.2.1 in this scenario.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Leader
Admin
So please describe how auditors typically address 4.2.1 in this scenario.
Auditors have to be aware of the customer and/or program specific requirements. Many of the QMS requirements are available online via OEM websites. A few examples include Quality Requirements and Information Terms & Conditions - Boeing Defense, Space & Security (BDS)
https://www.rtx.com/suppliers/united-technologies-suppliers/united-technologies-asqrd
https://us.airbus.com/sites/g/files/jlcbta141/files/2021-10/Supplier Quality Reqmts Manual (1).pdf

So, auditors, after identifying the customers related to a registrant should be able to figure out QMS requirements being invoked and assess the level of conformity.

For program, product, project, etc. specific requirements, auditors need to plan their audits to identify them early on during the audit and create audit trails to assess if the customer expectations are being fulfilled.

Conformance with customer requirements is the essence of any well executed quality system, therefore effective QMS audits need to focus on critical, relevant and current customer requirements, not simply generic standards mandates.
 

Randy

Super Moderator
It all starts in 4.2 "needs & expectations" and pops up in many other places, but mainly 4.2
 

n25philly

Starting to get Involved
I would say it depends. In a third party audit they are coming in to audit you to AS9100. Customer requirements are more important though, so it matters that you are meeting those requirements so I would say wherever there is cross over they will check to see if they are being met. If they are auditing a specific part of the standard they are not necessarily going to be coming in to audit that higher customer requirement, but if they see evidence that you aren't meeting it, it could be an issue.
 

Mike S.

Happy to be Alive
Trusted Information Resource
My auditors see certain customer names and know they have their own requirements, so they ask how we are meeting those. Also, during contract review, if they see customer Q clauses, they want to see how we meet them.
 

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly
Leader
Admin
If they are auditing a specific part of the standard they are not necessarily going to be coming in to audit that higher customer requirement, but if they see evidence that you aren't meeting it, it could be an issue.
That is incorrect. Any time a customer has a prescribed method, specification, process etc that is contractually flown down to a supplier, the CB auditor HAS to ensure that specific customer requirement is being satisfied.

One of the most typical criticisms of the IAQG Certification Oversight about CB auditors is the lack of planning and ensuring customer requirements are being met. That is exactly the reason for the AS9101 document to be so prescriptive.
 

mattador78

Quite Involved in Discussions
I got a minor on my last AS audit as we had missed a specific customer request on an old contract review. What we were doing which is 100% inspection exceeed what the customer required but that was with small orders (which is all we recieve). I didnt have a sample plan based on large batch orders of several thousand parts. This was specific to the one customer so i have just had to create the sampling plan (which we potentially will never use). It was a request from before we were AS accredited and before i was QM its just slipped through the gaps for the past five years including 2 audits from the customer
 

Big Jim

Admin
I got a minor on my last AS audit as we had missed a specific customer request on an old contract review. What we were doing which is 100% inspection exceeed what the customer required but that was with small orders (which is all we recieve). I didnt have a sample plan based on large batch orders of several thousand parts. This was specific to the one customer so i have just had to create the sampling plan (which we potentially will never use). It was a request from before we were AS accredited and before i was QM its just slipped through the gaps for the past five years including 2 audits from the customer

Truly non-value added activity tending to give a black eye to ISO 9001 based certification systems.
 
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