AS9100D, raw material standards are a requirement for manufacturing?

[FHM_Julian]

Hello, a note from our current AS auditor is that our small machine shop is lacking on section 8.4.2 D, last paragraph before section 8.4.3:

"When external provider test reports are utilized to verify externally provided products, the organization shall implement a process to evaluate the data in the test reports to confirm that the product meets requirements..."

When purchasing raw material for aerospace parts -currently- we order material with material certificates. The auditor has explained that it is not enough to have certificates that claim the lot/heat meets a certain standard, but that because of that last part of 8.4.2 d, we need to also purchase the material standard the customer is referencing and validate the certificate against the standard.

My concern here is that test agencies that issue these material certificates are the experts. Our small organization does not have a chemical engineer, so at the end of the day we are spending 81$ on a standard that someone is going to skim over and try to make sure the chemical compositions on the material certificate are within the parameters of the standard? My interpretation of this is that we are already buying special material, with a special certificate, that shows someone checked the material and is signing off that it meets X, Y, and/or Z standards. If this is a real requirement then it feels that it is one of the first parts of AS9100D that feels poorly implemented and unnecessary (at least for our company.)

Could anyone share a little insight on this with me? Thank you in advance.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

This issue has been discussed a number of times here. The auditor is correct, based on the IAQG expectations. Have a look at https://www.sae.org/iaqg/projects/9100-2016 Series Clarification Table 10-2019.pdf

 

[Al Rosen]

Hello, a note from our current AS auditor is that our small machine shop is lacking on section 8.4.2 D, last paragraph before section 8.4.3:

"When external provider test reports are utilized to verify externally provided products, the organization shall implement a process to evaluate the data in the test reports to confirm that the product meets requirements..."

When purchasing raw material for aerospace parts -currently- we order material with material certificates. The auditor has explained that it is not enough to have certificates that claim the lot/heat meets a certain standard, but that because of that last part of 8.4.2 d, we need to also purchase the material standard the customer is referencing and validate the certificate against the standard.

My concern here is that test agencies that issue these material certificates are the experts. Our small organization does not have a chemical engineer, so at the end of the day we are spending 81$ on a standard that someone is going to skim over and try to make sure the chemical compositions on the material certificate are within the parameters of the standard? My interpretation of this is that we are already buying special material, with a special certificate, that shows someone checked the material and is signing off that it meets X, Y, and/or Z standards. If this is a real requirement then it feels that it is one of the first parts of AS9100D that feels poorly implemented and unnecessary (at least for our company.)

Could anyone share a little insight on this with me? Thank you in advance.

AS9100 Rev B required that when material was accepted based on test reports that they be periodically validated(i.e. send out the material for testing and comparing the results). AS9100 RevC eliminated that requirement. AS9100D only requires comparing the test results to the requirements of the standard. Testing the material would impact you more than comparing the test report to the standard.

 

[Sidney Vianna]

Testing the material would impact you more than comparing the test report to the standard.

If the raw material is deemed a critical item, sample independent testing is required.

 

[Al Rosen]

If the raw material is deemed a critical item, sample independent testing is required.

I assumed that was not the case based on the quoted text

"When external provider test reports are utilized to verify externally provided products, the organization shall implement a process to evaluate the data in the test reports to confirm that the product meets requirements..."

 

[Big Jim]

That requirement certainly could have been written more clearly. There are two distinct parts, although that could be clearer.

The first part is, "When external providers test reports are utilized to verify externally provided products, the organization shall implement a process to evaluate the data in the test reports to confirm that the product meets requirements". It is not a prelude to the second part and stands alone. Basically you compare the material certs with the spec to ensure they match. If the full spec wasn't provided by the customer, but only referenced, you need to obtain a copy of the spec.

The second part is, "When a customer or organization has identified raw material as a significant operational risk )e.g., critical items), the organization shall implement a process to validate the accuracy of test reports". How this differs from what was in AS9100B is that you base the need for independent test results on risk, not just simply something done periodically.

Also, part one wasn't in AS9100B, perhaps leading to the confusion when told that the requirement was resurrected from AS9100B.

So when quoting the job with critical items that either the customer OR YOU have identified, allow for the cost of the lab tests.