Auditing the Safety Function - What tools should I use?

Sidney Vianna

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#11
Anyway, the poster didn't say they were auditing safety as a part of quality, just how to audit safety.
Actually, the question was
I am very confused about what I should be doing when it comes to ISO 9001 and safety. Someone please help me!!
So, I tried to make it clear that ISO 9001 has nothing to do with occupational health & safety. It is not my opinion. It is fact. From ISO 9001 0.4
This International Standard does not include requirements specific to other management systems, such as those particular to environmental management, occupational health and safety management, financial management or risk management. However, this International Standard enables an organization to align or integrate its own quality management system with related management system requirements.
And a crane failing and dropping all your product to the floor ruining it, and causing a delay in delivery because you shut the plant down waiting for repairs just because you did not do the safety inspections falls outside of the standard how?
Many business processes have implications that affect multiple management systems. For example: when you perform preventive maintenance on an overhead crane, you are improving the equipment uptime and minimizing the chances of a failure. By doing so, you are supporting your quality system, by preventing production disruption and late deliveries, as well supporting your “safety program”, by minimizing the chances of an incident or accident, due to equipment structural failure.

What you call “safety inspection”, others call maintenance checks.

All modern management system standards follow the PLAN-DO-CHECK-ACT model. It is an universal approach to systems deployment. But audits are a component of the CHECK stage. And, the check stage should be preceded of the plan and do stages. There is no point “auditing” something if no effort was put into planning and implementing it.

So, in my opinion, to do an audit of a “safety program” as part of an ISO 9001 internal audit does not make sense. If the organization has a true “safety program”, internal audits of the program should have been planned for, auditors should have been made competent for, etc. Not an add-on to an ISO 9001 internal audit.

As I said, several times, any successful organization has to address many stakeholders expectations. Quality, safety, financial, etc... It makes sense for their business processes to be managed with all such expectations. While compartmentalization of management systems is counterproductive, because it creates feuds within the organization, we have to keep in mind the boundaries and limitations of the management system subsets we operate with.

Integrated Management Systems is definitely the way to go, but that is very different than trying to "find a home" in ISO 9001 for safety programs. It does not fit.

Many quality improvements will beneficially impact an organization environmental and safety performance. Others will detract from it. Top management has to balance all the different objectives at hand.
 
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Randy

Super Moderator
#12
EJ there is also a difference between auditing the process of safety (which would based on sampling) as opposed to performing safety inspection or verifiying compliance with safety regulations which is more in depth and detailed to specifics..

You need to be a bit more clear in this case.
 
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EJE0622

#13
After reading all of your posts, am I correct in understanding that I can audit the safety process, but I can stay away from the details because it should already be covered in OSHA regulations. What I should be looking for is document control on the documents that affect are new hires (we are government contractor that supplies people). Anything much more than that falls outside of ISO's pervue??
 

Randy

Super Moderator
#14
Gov't contractor? Not a problem...1st you need to look for specific requirements in the contract you need to meet.

There is some guidance (FREE) on OSHA's website under the VPP protocol's, we have a bunch here in the Cove (use the search) or you could use what they use in Alberta, Canada for example (just take out whatever isn't applicable).
 

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EJE0622

#15
That attachment is AWESOME!!! Thank you SOOOO much. That definitely puts it into perspective for me!!

Thanks for everyone's help! It is greatly appreciated!
 

SteelMaiden

Super Moderator
Super Moderator
#16
What you call “safety inspection”, others call maintenance checks.

No, actually Sidney, there is a difference, and crane inspections (mobile equipment) are a requirement under OSHA. Safety Inspections in industry do not have to be performed by maintenance personnel where maintenance checks need to be performed by someone qualified to perform maintenance. (scenarios may change from plant to plant depending upon the organization, union status, etc.)
 

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert
Staff member
Admin
#17
I agree that we should not overdo ourselves in auditing safety for the sake of ISO900X. The issue is merely how one can show the Safety function supports customer satisfaction through good product and services. Arguably the list of questions I gave is more than what's needed. It is, however, something that can be covered in less than 90 minutes.

Your state's Department of Labor may have free training available through the U.S. Dept of Labor.
 
L

little__cee

#18
We've discussed this subject a great deal at our company because our Registrar auditor ALWAYS includes safety in our audits. He's claimed it under 6.3 or 6.4 (or both, if memory serves) and always asks questions about safety improvements and/or processes.

Several people here questioned if he should be doing any of this but we've always just taken the ideas to the safety committee -- no harm, no foul!
 

Sidney Vianna

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#19
We've discussed this subject a great deal at our company because our Registrar auditor ALWAYS includes safety in our audits. He's claimed it under 6.3 or 6.4 (or both, if memory serves) and always asks questions about safety improvements and/or processes.

Several people here questioned if he should be doing any of this but we've always just taken the ideas to the safety committee -- no harm, no foul!
As long as your organization welcomes an external auditor overstepping the boundaries and scope of an audit, no problem.

However, for other Covers that might be facing the same situation and might not be happy with an auditor failing to understand the limits of an audit, they should understand that auditors behaving as described, can (and probably should) be challenged by the auditee.
 
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